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The Benefits of Wakame Seaweed Salad on Blood Pressure

I used to think of seaweed as just a beneficial whole-food source of minerals like iodine, for which it is the most concentrated dietary source. Indeed, just a daily half-teaspoon of mild seaweeds, like arame or dulse, or two sheets of nori should net you all the iodine you need for the day. But, the intake of seaweeds is advised not only as a whole-food source of iodine, but also, evidently, “for the prevention of lifestyle-related diseases, including cancer, cardiovascular and cerebrovascular disease….” Based on what?

As I discuss in my video Wakame Seaweed Salad May Lower Blood Pressure, the reasoning is that the Japanese live long and eat seaweed, so there is speculation that seaweed might have “influence on life expectancy,” based on suggestive reports. But when we see long lists of the supposed benefits a particular food is purported to have, such as “compounds found in [seaweed] have various biological activities including anticoagulant, anti-viral, antioxidant, anti-allergic, anti-cancer, anti-inflammatory, anti-obesity, and neuroprotective properties,” we need to know if they are based on clinical data, meaning studies with actual people, or so-called preclinical data, that is, from test tubes and lab animals. I mean, what are we supposed to do with a study talking about the effects of “seaweed-restructured pork diets” on rats? Those researchers tried to use seaweed, as well as other ingredients, to “improv[e] the ‘image’ of meat product.” Researchers also tried to add grape seeds to meat, they tried flaxseeds, they tried walnuts, they tried purple rice, and they even tried “thong-weed.”

When you look at epidemiological studies, where you compare the diets and disease rates within a population, you see that Japanese pre-schoolers who eat seaweed tend to have lower blood pressures, suggesting “seaweed might have beneficial effects on blood pressure among children.” That could make sense given all the minerals and fiber in seaweed, but cause and effect can’t be proven with this kind of study. Perhaps other components of the diet that went along with seaweed eating that made the difference.

It’s even harder to do these kinds of studies on adults, since so many people are on high blood pressure medications. University of Tokyo researchers took an innovative approach by comparing the diets of people on different intensities of medication: low-dose of a single blood pressure drug, high-dose of a single drug, and multiple drugs. And, although they all had artificially normalized blood pressure “as a result of effective medication,” those who ate the most fruits and sea vegetables tended to be the ones on the lower dose of a single drug, supporting a dietary role for seaweed. An interesting finding, but why not just put it to the test?

A double-blind, crossover trial found that seaweed fiber lowered blood pressure, apparently by pulling sodium out of the system. Real seaweed couldn’t be used in the study, because the subjects wouldn’t be able to be fooled with a placebo, but why not just put whole powdered seaweed into pills? That was finally attempted ten years later. Compared to doing nothing, subjects receiving a daily dose of dried wakame powder in capsules had beautiful drops in blood pressure. The researchers, however, desalinized the seaweed, taking out about two-thirds of the sodium naturally found in it. So, we still don’t know if eating seaweed salad is actually going to help with blood pressure. What we need is a randomized, controlled trial with plain, straight seaweed. No one had ever done that research, until…they did!

Six grams of wakame, with all of its natural sodium, led to a significant drop in blood pressure, especially in those who started out with high pressure. The subjects experienced only minor side effects and ones that could be expected with increasing fiber intake. A nice thing about whole-food, plant-based interventions is that we sometimes get good side effects, such as the resolution of gastritis (stomach inflammation) some subject had been having, as well as the disappearance of chronic headaches. 


What other foods might help with high blood pressure? See:

For more on preventing and treating hypertension, one of our leading killers, see:

Want more on seaweed and iodine? Check out:

My video Salt of the Earth: Sodium and Plant-Based Diets further addresses the sodium question.

In health,
Michael Greger, M.D.

PS: If you haven’t yet, you can subscribe to my free videos here and watch my live, year-in-review presentations:

Discuss

Michael Greger M.D., FACLM

Michael Greger, M.D. FACLM, is a physician, New York Times bestselling author, and internationally recognized professional speaker on a number of important public health issues. Dr. Greger has lectured at the Conference on World Affairs, the National Institutes of Health, and the International Bird Flu Summit, testified before Congress, appeared on The Dr. Oz Show and The Colbert Report, and was invited as an expert witness in defense of Oprah Winfrey at the infamous "meat defamation" trial.


112 responses to “The Benefits of Wakame Seaweed Salad on Blood Pressure

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  1. Looked at the study and

    Waist circumference changed for women participants.

    Wakame might be one of the things I would be tempted to buy in supplement form.

  2. The lines from the breast cancer and nori video that I feel like should be posted as a warning every time seaweed comes up as a topic are:

    “In fact, too much seaweed of any type may actually increase one’s risk of thyroid cancer, because of the amount of iodine you’d be taking in.

    But, there does not appear to be increased risk at the levels of consumption I’m talking about—like, you know, a sheet of nori every day. And, a study of seaweed eaters in California actually found decreased risk. But, again, we’re talking, you know, kind of modest levels of intake.”

    I want to verify that the sentence means that a sheet of nori every day is what Dr. Greger means as “modest levels of intake” since some of us are trying to be nice to our thyroids.

    I have been eating watercress for iodine. Does that have a similar issue?

  3. I’ll have to start adding dulse to my salads again. Last Christmas my daughter showed me a delicious way to perk up a salad. To your salad vegetables mix in chopped dulse, chopped avocado, a shake of cayenne pepper, a drizzle of lemon and a drizzle of maple syrup. Sooo good!!!

  4. The effect of blood pressure medication is not at all the same if the pill is taken in the morning or in the evening.

    Taken the morning, a blood pressure pill increase the risk of cardiovascular deaths, compared to the same pill taken the evening.

    Bedtime hypertension treatment improves cardiovascular risk reduction: the Hygia Chronotherapy Trial
    https://academic.oup.com/eurheartj/advance-article/doi/10.1093/eurheartj/ehz754/5602478

    So the effect might also be different according to the time when the wakame capsule is being ingested (morning vs bedtime)

  5. Is the seaweed salad offered at sushi takeout in stores a legitimate and healthy option? If not, where can you get a prepared seaweed salad or a supplement to take?

    1. I believe most if not all of those prepared salads use artificial coloring to make the wakame bright green, so as to imply freshness. I found a prepared seaweed salad made from wakame without any artificial coloring at my local health food store. The natural appearance of wakame in this form is a very dull green, almost bordering on brown. Hope this information helps.

  6. I was directed on the web site to ask my question I wanted researched after a video in the comments section. This question though is a different topic…here it is.

    Any specific diet shown to help restlesd legs which is a dopimine dysfunction?

    1. Jan,

      Do you supplement B-12? And, if so, try something other than Methyl B-12. A few of us got insufficiency symptoms while supplementing with Methyl B-12. It isn’t shelf-stable and is less reliable than Cyano B-12, but if you are anti-Cyano, try adding Hydroxo or Adesonyl or both. (Some PubMed articles recommend using 2 or all 3 other types if you don’t use Cyano – if you are having symptoms, it might be worth it to try a different combination. I was having restless leg and I was getting Charley horses and other symptoms all of which went away when I switched off of Methyl)

      Do you eat enough foods with Folate and with Magnesium?

      Dark leafy greens, grains, nuts, seeds, legumes, soy all can help.

      Iron, folate or vitamin B12 deficiency all can cause RLS.

      Foods with iron

      Legumes: black beans, chickpeas, lentils, lima beans, soybeans, tofu, tempeh
      Grains: brown rice, oatmeal, quinoa, or fortified cereals
      Nuts and seeds: cashews, pine nuts, pistachio, pumpkin seeds, sunflower seeds, sesame seeds
      Vegetables: Swiss chard, collard greens, tomato sauce
      Other: blackstrap molasses, prune juice

      For Folate: asparagus, avocado, beans, Brussel sprouts, greens, lentils, rice, quinoa, whole-wheat pasta

      For Magnesium: almonds, black beans, brown rice, whole grain bread, cashews, edamame, peanuts, peanut butter, soy milk, spinach, tofu, tempeh

      Also, add foods with Vitamin C to increase absorption of Iron: broccoli, Brussel sprouts, Kiwi, Lemon, Oranges, Papaya, Strawberries, Thyme

      Don’t eat too much spinach for the whole oxalate thing.

      There are other things like not eating sugary foods, but the main thing is to make sure you are getting enough of the nutrients.

      Hey, if you are taking Methyl B-12 and change that and it fixes it, please come back and tell us.

      I have a handful of people who have had it, but I am interested in how big the issue is because most stores only sell Methyl form nowadays and I did get symptoms.

      1. Turmeric would be another one because sometimes it is caused by inflammation, rather than iron or folate or B12, so an anti-inflammatory diet is a must and Dr. Greger does have videos on inflammation.

        The big thing about inflammation is that the more vegetables you eat the better.

        Also, watch his Parkinson’s videos because the brain changes in that can be associated with it and Dr. Greger has videos on preventing and treating that.

        1. I should add that I am not a moderator and they may show up and give an official answer and Dr. Greger will also add your topic to his topic list.

          I just have had it and I know that it is annoying.

            1. I just thought of one more question.

              Have you been supplementing Folate instead of eating your plant foods?

              You might have a Folate Trap phenomenon.

              Dr. McDougall has a video someplace on it.

              Note to Dr. Greger and team. The Folate trap is a topic I am interested in. So many people are being told to take Methyl Folate because of the whole MTHFR thing. Is there a safe level? I think Dr. McDougall said that anything over 200 mg goes to the Folate trap. Some sources recommend eating foods with Methionine to increase the enzyme to metabolize the Folate supplements but vegans and cancer patients and people with Homocysteine don’t want too much Methionine.

              Would peanuts be a high enough source of Methionine to stop the trap?

                1. Drink enough water. Dehydration makes it worse.

                  Try things to increase blood flow. Exercise, for sure, but if that is hard for some reason there are gadgets.

                  Infrared LED light panels or Micropulse ICES PEMF or a Vie Light type nasal light or Whole Body Vibration all increase blood flow. (There are knock-off’s of the vie light in the sinus section on Amazon for $25)

                  There is even a vibration product specifically for restless legs.

                  https://www.medgadget.com/2014/06/relaxis-the-first-medical-device-approved-in-u-s-for-restless-leg-syndrome.html

                  My restless legs went away switching Vitamin B-12 but my friend needed Magnesium for hers. If it is nutrition or something like homocysteine, I think you will need to fix your nutrition.

                  But the gadgets are good for improving blood flow to the legs.

                  You can get a heat lamp version of infrared on Amazon also for about $20 and get a brooder lamp. That was amazing for warming. The LED version is cool to the touch and still improves circulation.

                  As far as the vibration goes, you can get a much cheaper whole body vibration machine online.

                  For PEMF, I love my Micropulse ICES and you might be able to regrow your knee cartilage at the same time you treat your restless legs.

                  If you are wealthy, a Curatron has very cool before and after knee cartilage images, but if you are poor, Bob Dennis is who sells his ICES and he is awesome.

                  1. If you go the gadget route, I should warn you that most PEMF’s are old technology, particularly the most expensive ones. I do trust Bob Dennis and I do have his MicroPulse ICES and really like it. He is the one who originally worked with NASA on PEMF and he quit when some of the people there wanted to do unscrupulous things with his technology and he won in court when NASA tried to take his technology.

                    The wider industry is a con-artist industry, but there are a few good people in it and Bob is science-oriented.

            1. Well, I guess since the same diet causes everything it makes sense to get all of them.

              Many people get what is called, “a cluster” of diseases.

              1. Also, things like restless legs are often caused by a deficiency and I was definitely low in Magnesium and Folate and Potassium and Vitamin D and had dehydration from not drinking enough water which is another thing that can cause it. I definitely had high homocysteine which is associated.

                If you are low in Magnesium, you can also be low in Potassium.

                https://medcraveonline.com/PPIJ/PPIJ-04-00079.pdf

                Also, I was doing caretaking and wasn’t exercising and blood flow improves it.

    2. “Any specific diet shown to help restless legs which is a dopamine dysfunction?”

      Yes: no fat, and no big meals, as fat and big meals increase bile acids production, thus resulting in more bile acids spillover into the bloodstream, which end up crossing the blood-brain barrier and altering the parts of the brain responsible for dopamine regulation.

    3. I’ve struggled with RLS for a few years, and have finally found some relief. I increased my iron, magnesium, and potassium intake. I actually took chelated iron supplements, magnesium glycinate, and drink plain coconut water for a potassium boost.
      Even though I’ve followed a wfpb diet for several years, I guess I couldn’t get quite enough of these through my diet to affect the RLS (maybe because of heavy periods?)

  7. Hi Everyone and Dr. Michael Greger,

    Thank you for the very interesting article about seaweed. I would like to celebrate another vegetable in my comment : squash. Do you know how I discovered that you could eat it raw and enjoy all its vitamins ? By reading an article written in English that explained that squash meant “that which you can eat raw” in Native American language. I still find it amazing to discover such awesome things thanks to my knowledge of English. I am thankful for it so thank you everyone who taught me English (wow, that’s a lot of people !) French T. Diane :)

  8. I often eat a small serving of Dulse (“Wild Atlantic Sea Vegetable” from Maine Coast Sea Vegetables) at lunch. I started eating it as a replacement for potato chips (one of my many downfalls), and it’s a small serving, since a package weights 2 oz, and it lasts for 2 or more weeks with both my husband and I eating from it.

    I first had a Wakame salad decades ago at a vegan restaurant in Paris — and it was delicious! Served with sesame seeds, as I recall. But that Wakame was dark brown, and the Wakame I find in this country usually looks like it’s dyed a bright fluorescent green. I wonder: is it in fact dyed green? If so, why?

    Anyway, I really like the taste of the seaweeds I eat. To me, “sea food” means “sea vegetable” which means — so far — sea weeds Dulse and Wakame.

    1. “I often eat a small serving of Dulse (“Wild Atlantic Sea Vegetable” from Maine Coast Sea Vegetables) at lunch.”
      – – – –

      Dr. J., I forgot about my own (4 oz.) package of Dulse Flakes — organic, Maine Coast. I bought it can’t remember how many years ago from a health food store. Wow, though….1 tablespoon (I’d just sprinkle a bit on whatever) contains 330% iodine! Seems to me that’s a helluva lot.

      I don’t see an expiration date on the package but, as I say, it’s been up in the cupboard for so long some of the print has rubbed off/faded.

      I’ll have to start using it again.

  9. Is there any correlation between seaweed and spirulina? The only articles on this site are from 2013 or older so I wonder if there’s any update.

  10. I eat seaweed salad about 5 times weekly. This is wakame and red dulse salad. I am 67 female, plant based, runner and my bp is 99/68, hr is 55. Some say I have hypotension. I feel great and have more energy then I burn off. Seaweed… everyone should eat it.

  11. I don’t know about other seaweeds but dukes has a huge amount of potassium in it. Could that be what pulls the sodium out of people and lowers the blood pressure?

    1. Glenn,

      I read sometime in the misty past that it was not so much the absolute amount of sodium that was an issue, but rather the ratio of potassium to sodium that was important; that ratio should be about 4:1, but for most people it was more like 1:4. Because most people ate highly salty food, and very few veggies and fruit, which have higher levels of potassium than animal products.

      Perhaps both are important: the ratio of potassium to sodium, and the absolute amount of sodium, in the diet.

      And I don’t know if that is still an accepted theory. Since I’ve seen so little about it since.

      1. An update to my comment above about the potassium ratio: It’s still important. Though my numbers might be a bit off.

        “Our Stone Age ancestors consumed about 16 times more potassium than sodium. Modern tribes of hunter-gatherers have similarly high ratios. That’s a far cry from the average American diet, which has about twice as much sodium as potassium. In a typical example — bacon, eggs, and tomato juice for breakfast; a ham sandwich and a soda for lunch; a bag of tortilla chips for a snack; and fettuccine alfredo, canned green beans, and garlic bread for dinner — there are 1,600 mg of potassium and 4,100 mg of sodium, for a ratio of 0.4 to 1…

        The best way to get more potassium and less sodium is by eating more fresh fruits and vegetables, beans, fish, homemade foods, and low-salt versions of prepared foods.”

        https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/potassium_and_sodium_out_of_balance

        So the recommendation is more whole plant foods. And more cooking at home.

    1. Glenn,

      I must have “autocorrect” in my head: I misread your “dukes” as “dulse,” and had to re-read it several times to figure out the source of your frustration!

  12. I read and learn a lot about high blood pressure. I have a natural low bp and sometimes a very/to low. I would like a topic on that. The doctor gives me the advice to eat more salt. I don’t like that. Other options?
    And for now the question: if I eat food that lowers bp does that also lower mine? Or is there a limit?

    1. Cornelia,

      Do you take B-12, and which kind?

      Being low can cause a drop in blood pressure.

      A few people I have interacted with had the same experience that I did where we became symptomatic while supplementing with Methyl B12. If you use Methyl, you may need to add one of the other versions. Also, Methyl isn’t shelf stable, so it can be affected by heat and light. Cyano version is much more stable and more reliable, though you can take Methyl with one of the other versions and those tested more reliable when you take a few together.

      1. Being low in Folate or low in hydration or low thyroid from being low in iodine or selenium all could cause a drop in blood pressure. (Just don’t go too high in iodine or selenium either. One Brazil nut and a little seaweed, not kelp because that is too much)

        Licorice tea has a study for increasing blood pressure.

        Eating big meals lowers blood pressure, so lowering the size of meals might help. (I looked that up when I was learning about preventing strokes from keeping blood pressure low.)

        Take your blood pressure before meals to see if it is just a dip from eating or drink a glass of water before meals and if I am remembering right the water causes the food to cause less of a drop in blood pressure.

        1. Thank you for the advice. I know it’s not a dip after meal or drink. I can wake up with a low bp.
          I will buy the tea and Brazil nuts.
          I eat sushibowl regualy.

          Glad there is more to do than just salt.

        1. The tea sounds promising.

          The B12 I have interacted with a few people now who Methyl wasn’t enough by itself.

          It didn’t make sense because I knew that I was supplementing but I was symptomatic and all of the symptoms pointed to B12.

          How often do you take it? Methyl requires more than Cyano.

          1. Again, I don’t know the brands you mention. I take a daily 1.000ug
            And I take bloodtests once a year.

            Think I also have dips when I don’t hydrate enough. That explains the dips in the mornig. Dizzy when I get out of bed. But that is something I already knew. You gave me more.
            Thanks again. It’s almost 01.00 a clock at night in the Netherlands now, so I go to sleep.
            Wish you a good and healthy day!

            1. Cornelia

              Deb is not writing about different brands of B12. She is writing about different forms or types of B12

              ‘.In dietary supplements, vitamin B12 is usually present as cyanocobalamin [5], a form that the body readily converts to the active forms methylcobalamin and 5-deoxyadenosylcobalamin. Dietary supplements can also contain methylcobalamin and other forms of vitamin B12.

              Existing evidence does not suggest any differences among forms with respect to absorption or bioavailability. However the body’s ability to absorb vitamin B12 from dietary supplements is largely limited by the capacity of intrinsic factor. For example, only about 10 mcg of a 500 mcg oral supplement is actually absorbed in healthy people [8].’
              https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/VitaminB12-HealthProfessional/

              People often shorten these long technical names to ‘cyano’ and ‘methyl’ etc.

              By the way, are you sure that you have low blood pressure? People often write here that they are worried about their supposed low blood pressure when in fact their blood pressure is in the ideal range. That is because in Westernised societies high blood pressure is normal.

              http://www.bloodpressureuk.org/BloodPressureandyou/Thebasics/Bloodpressurechart

              1. Thank you for explaining this to me. Now I understand and looked closer to the label. It is Cyno.

                And yes I’m sure about the bp. Have it my whole life, even when I was pregnate. A bit higher but still low. Normaly not to low, but I have my dips and the only advice from the doctor to take (more) salt. I eat plant based sos.

                Glad with the tips from Deb.

            2. I feel concerned about high doses of vitamin supplementation, like 1000 mcg a day for vitamin B12, when the RDA is only actually 2,4 mcg a day.

              Vitamin B12 is alleged to have antioxydant properties.

              See: “Vitamin B12 in Relation to Oxidative Stress: A Systematic Review( van de Lagemaat et al, 2019)”

              B12 may not accumulate into the body cells as they are water-soluble, but daily intake of high doses may imply high antioxydants levels into the general circulation every day, and that may possibly interwith with and defeat the attempts of the immune system to get rid of unwanted cells, and limiting autophagy.

              That may be why high doses of vitamin B, like vitamin B12, are linked to an increase of cancer.

              As explains Thomas Campbell: “Recently, there has been some evidence that large dose B12 supplementation may be associated with an increase in cancer risk in some groups.[1] Because of these findings, and because I can’t find plain B12 supplements smaller than 500 mcg per pill, I’ve been recommending people take a multivitamin.* We only need about 2.4 mcg of B12 daily. So choose a multivitamin with a low level of B12 (perhaps 10-20mcg), and relatively low levels of everything else.”
              https://nutritionstudies.org/12-questions-answered-regarding-vitamin-b12/

              In Europe, only UK, to my knowledge, sells cyanocobalamin with relatively low doses of B12, like 25mcg, which is already way greater than the daily RDA…

              1. Dr Greger recommends 50 mcg per day – bearing in mind that the US NIH state that ‘
                only about 10 mcg of a 500 mcg oral supplement is actually absorbed in healthy people [8].’

                However, the US NIH also note:

                “Some people—particularly older adults, those with pernicious anemia, and those with reduced levels of stomach acidity (hypochlorhydria or achlorhydria) or intestinal disorders—have difficulty absorbing vitamin B12 from food and, in some cases, oral supplements [25,26]. As a result, vitamin B12 deficiency is common, affecting between 1.5% and 15% of the general population [27,28]. In many of these cases, the cause of the vitamin B12 deficiency is unknown [8].’

                This appears to be why Dr Greger recommends 1,000 mcg per day for people aged 65 and older

                The US NIH also observes

                “no adverse effects have been associated with excess vitamin B12 intake from food and supplements in healthy individuals” [5].

                Findings from intervention trials support these conclusions. In the NORVIT and HOPE 2 trials, vitamin B12 supplementation (in combination with folic acid and vitamin B6) did not cause any serious adverse events when administered at doses of 0.4 mg for 40 months (NORVIT trial) and 1.0 mg for 5 years (HOPE 2 trial) [65,66].’

                https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/VitaminB12-HealthProfessional/

                1. From the study [8] quoted by your link:

                  “The central physiologic principles are that clinically important deficiency is more likely to occur (and progress) when intrinsic factor-driven absorption fails than when diet is poor and that most causes take years to produce clinically obvious deficiency. ”
                  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18606874?dopt=Abstract

                  Therefore, giving more of something that can not be absorbed might not be relevant for that approach…

                  What would cause the incorrect absorption of vitamin B12 ?

                  Damages to the epithelial cells caused by fats into the diet ? Lack of fibers binding to bile acids ? Lack of plant foods and thus of antioxydants scavenging ROS into the digestive tract ? Too much antioxydants scavenging nitric oxyde and thus damaging the epithelial cells ? Too less antioxydants leading to too much nitric oxyde damaging the epithelial cells ?

                  1. From the same study[8]:
                    For healthy subjects with no absorption problems:

                    Amount (percentage) absorbed from a single oral dose of:
                    1 mcg -> 0.56 mcg (56%)
                    10 mcg -> 1.6 mcg (16%)
                    50 mcg -> 1.5 mcg (3%)
                    500 mcg -> 9.7 mcg (2%)
                    1000 mcg -> 13 mcg (1.3%)

                    The more the intake of B12, the less it can be absorbed, and the B12 pool into the body is estimated to be equal to 2500 mcg.

                    So there seems to be a rate-limiting factor to the absorption of B12, and that rate-limiting factor may be further diminished in the case of a problem into the B12 transport chain.

                    Would the immune system itself control the rate-limiting factor of B12 absorption ? So if the immune system is impaired, because of inflammation, it may cause a problem into the B12 transport chain.

                    1. For subjects with malabsorption we have:
                      Amount (percentage) absorbed from a single oral dose of:
                      1 mcg -> 0.01 mcg (1.2%)
                      10 mcg -> 0.1 mcg (1.2%)
                      50 mcg -> 0.6 mcg (1.2%)
                      500 mcg -> 7.0 mcg (1.3%)
                      1000 mcg -> 12 mcg (1.2%)

                      What one can see is that for high doses like 500 mcg and 1000 mcg, subjects with malabsorption in fact absorb nearly as much as healthy subjects with no problem of absorption…

                      So it may indicate that the surplus in vitamin B12 may actually act as an antioxydant and is able to fix the problem of malabsorption in malabsorptive subjects.

                      So the issue with incorrect absorption might be due to inflammation or reactive oxygen species that the surplus in vitamin B12 is able to scavenge by acting as antioxydant, and that there is a need for 500 to 1000 mcg of antioxydant to fix that problem in the transport chain for malabsorptive subjects.

                      The B12 transport chain may explain why only vitamin B12 (and not some other antioxydants) is able to fix the problem if the problem is local to the endothelial cells in charge of absorbing the B12. The transport chain thus may actually work in malabsorptive people and brings the B12 at the point of absorption where ROS may cumulate.

                      If enough antioxydants come to that point of absorption, then the ROS damaging the absorption mechanism may finally be lessen to the points that the absorption rate becomes as efficient in healthy subjects than in malabsorptive subjects.

                    2. The problem is that if the antioxydant role of vitamin B12 is helpful, by helping the absorption in malabsorptive subjects, once vitamin B12 enters into the system its antioxydant nature may become detrimental, as studies have shown that doses of B12 superior to 55 mcg/day doubles the risk off lung cancers in men smokers…

                      Long-Term, Supplemental, One-Carbon Metabolism-Related Vitamin B Use in Relation to Lung Cancer Risk in the Vitamins and Lifestyle (VITAL) Cohort.
                      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28829668

                      So antioxydants (like vitamins), once absorbed into the bloodstream at high dose, may promote cancer development.

                    3. Dr Greger covers the rate limiting absorption in his videos.

                      He takes that into account for how much he recommends.

                      The thing is, in real life, fortified foods aren’t what is causing cancer.

                      You don’t hear a vegan bounce in cancer from Nutritional yeast or fortified plant milk.

                      The diseases for vegans are when people don’t supplement.

                    4. Deb, no. I’m talking about high doses supplementation, not fortified foods.

                      The body only needs a few mcg every day, but the industry supplement mainly sells hundreds or thousands of mcg for daily consumption use…

                      B12 supplementation as it is nowadays is a health bomb.

                2. “Dr Greger recommends 1,000 mcg per day for people aged 65 and older”

                  The risk balance between B12 supplementation induced cancers and B12 deficiency induced disease may rather point towards lower daily recommendations for B12 supplementation in the context of healthy eating.

                3. What doesn’t tell you dr Greger is that the vitamin B12 malabsorption in elderly is based on a scientific “fraud”:

                  “The investigators who patented the diagnostic application of metabolites to cobalamin deficiency took this one step
                  further. Observing cobalamin levels above 200 ng/L in 2.9% to
                  5.2% of patients with clinical signs of deficiency66 (in reality, an
                  excellent 95%-97% sensitivity for the traditional 200-ng/L cutpoint), they raised the cutpoint to 350 ng/L.[10] This redefinition transformed a 5.3% rate of suspected deficiency in their elderly volunteers to an astounding 40.5%.[10] Only approximately 22% of the new suspects actually met MMA criteria for deficiency, less than 2% had macrocytosis, and none had evidence of PA.[10]”

                  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2532799/

                  This was based on:
                  Lindenbaum J, Rosenberg IH, Wilson PWF, Stabler SP, Allen RH. Prevalence of cobalamin deficiency in the Framingham elderly population. Am J Clin Nutr. 1994;60:2-11

                  1. Dr Greger’s numbers come from studies about bringing Homocysteine down to a safe level.

                    As far as the cancer cases, the response I saw was that in the USA we have been eating bread and cereals and milk which have been fortified with B12 for many decades and that did not cause an increase in cancer.

                    When people stopped smoking the rates of lung cancer dropped dramatically.

                    1. Okay, vegans are the ones taking more of it and they don’t have more cancer than other groups.

                      Within the Adventist community lung cancer is rare, and it is mostly smokers who get it.

                      But of the 20% -do the ones who supplement B12 get it more or less and do they die more or less.

                      I wonder if the Sherzai’s have a Q&A anywhere.

                      Meaning, it isn’t a large risk factor, but is it a small one and what is the mechanism and compare that risk factor to MS and spine rotting out and brain diseases from high Homocysteine.

                    2. I mentally can think of potential mechanisms to look for.

                      First of all, the Folate Trap comes to mind, but if they have been fortifying bread with folate, do people get it from that or maybe not because of Methionine. But there are multi-slice eating Blue Zones.

                      Do either of them lower the enzyme that broccoli increases or mess up the broccoli receptor or microbiome or PH or cause the blood to Rod that whole sticking together thing? Or raise IGF-1 or IL-6 or Methionine?

                    3. What I am saying is that Dr Ralph Carmel debunked in 2013 the idea that elderly have more difficulty to absorb vitamin B12, and thus that they have to get high daily doses of B12 supplementation.

                      That idea comes from the arbitrary increase of the cutpoint into the data by mistakenly confounding the cutpoint sensitivity with new cases above the cutpoint, leading to a 35% increase in supected deficient subjects…

                      Amongst the newly suspected deficient elderly people, only 2% of them have a clinical symptom, and according to Dr Carmel, this symptom could as well be attributed to alcohol consumption, and not necessarily to a B12 deficiency, like it is also the case for neuropathy.

                    4. The real danger with low B12 levels comes from nitrous oxyde (N2O) intoxication, which is both an anesthesiant widely used by dentists and surgeons and a drug also named “laughing gas” that is widely used amongst a subset of the population and particularly young people.

                      N2O intoxication can cause serious neurological damages, some of which are not every time reversible:

                      Severe Neurologic Deficit after Nitrous Oxide Anesthesia
                      https://anesthesiology.pubs.asahq.org/article.aspx?articleid=1949600

                    5. Deb, did you see the movie “Joker” ?

                      The main character, Arthur Fleck, played by Joaquin Phoenix, is a good medical case of endogenous N2O oxydation in human beings.

                    6. Nitrous oxyde intoxication with low B12 levels leading potentially to severe neurologic deficit under anesthesia, that’s why you might want to prefer “forks over knives”.

            3. Hi Cornella, thanks for your comments and thanks to Deb for her good suggestions. Please also listen to your doctor as regards to salt intake as in the body there should be a glance of potassium and salt.
              thanks

    2. Cornelia,I’ll mention your request for video/bog on low BP although as you know this is so much less common than hypertension. As you’re undoubtedly aware, natural low bp is healthy, but because you’ve mentioned you have very low BP and your doctor has recommended some treatment, I’m assuming you have clarified you do not have an underlying health problem causing this and lifestyle treatments are in order. Certainly monitor your symptoms and keep track of episodes of lightheadedness. Meanwhile this comprehensive article may be helpful, particularly because it mentions several lifestyle approaches to hypotension including what to do if your dr recommends taking some salt and what you can do instead: https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/low-blood-pressure/diagnosis-treatment/drc-20355470

  13. Hello all. I have tried ‘seaweed salad’ purchased on a salad bar in a local grocery store. It was $9.99 pound. I was told by a passer by not to think about eating it all like a regular type of salad but to use it as a kinda garnish on top of a salad or added to a sandwich with other veggies. I asked the store clerk about where it came from. He brought out a frozen bag covered in foreign words. The ingredients were in English and included oil, seaweed, sesame oil and seeds, ginger, sugar. I asked if I could get plain. He misunderstood and said he could defrost in the micro wave. I did purchase a bit, enjoyed it but will not return for more. I’ll search for a different source that lists nutrition information without other ingredients. I think there was a shaker type but am open for ideas.

    1. At Whole Foods, there are shaker tops and seaweed snacks.

      There is Wakame Ramen and that is pretty cheap.

      I wonder if heating destroys anything.

      1. There is a bag of wakame by itself.

        Also in the seasonings there are shaker bottles.

        Bragg has a kelp shaker bottle. Dr. Greger said that there is too much iodine in kelp, but I am wondering if it is just shaking a little on a salad if that is already too much?

      2. Heat destroys iodine
        Boiling seaweed in water for 15-30 minutes appears to be sufficient in reducing iodine content in the seaweed (as it is leeched into the water and iodine may be released into the atmosphere due to it being a gas in its natural state), and this processing may eliminate up to 99% of iodine from Kombu (other seaweeds may not have such a high loss). Additionally a study found boiling water may also remove arsenic from seaweed, which was found in seaweed in New England.

        Due to such high losses of iodine from seaweed, usually processed or cooked seaweed does not carry as significant a risk of iodine toxicity (such high risk being seem with raw kelp products)
        https://examine.com/nutrition/how-can-i-safely-consume-seaweed/

        Iodine from seaweed is relatively well absorbed, ranging from around 60% to complete absorption.[10] That being said, iodine can be significantly reduced from kombu via heat treatment (boiling for 15 minutes eliminates up to 99% of iodine) whereas other genera may have lower losses, such as 40% in sargassum,[7] and this processing of kelp is sometimes associated with application of a dye to result in the products “ao-kombu” or “kizami-kombu” (boiling for 30 minutes in dye and then hang drying).[7] Due to this processing, some sources have noted variability in Kombu products (in this source, soup) between 660µg/L and 31,000µg/L (or 165-7,750µg per 250mL serving).[11]

        Furthermore, many traditional dishes utilizing seaweed in the Japanese diet tend to also include vegetables with a known goitrogen content (broccoli, cabbage, bok choi and soy)[7][6] which are known to compete with iodine for uptake into the thyroid[12][13] or in the case of soy isoflavones reduce the incorporation of iodine into active thyroid hormones;[14] this attenuates possible thyrotoxicosis from high iodine intake. Furthermore, some species of seaweeds may contain high levels of the nondietary mineral bromide (as bromine)[15] which also possesses anti-thyroid properties[16] which may reduce the risk of thyrotoxicosis.

        Despite the aforementioned, there are still many cases of iodine induced goitre and thyrotoxicosis associated with high seaweed consumption (mostly Kombu) that is successfully treated with seaweed and iodine restriction.[17][11][18][19][20]
        https://examine.com/supplements/iodine/

        That being said iodine is recommended in supplement form to avoid deficiency,especially in those who are pregnant or avoiding salt or vegetarian/vegan.

        Iodine and Seaweeds

        If you regularly eat seaweed (multiple times a week), you will probably get adequate iodine from the seaweed. However, the availability of iodine from seaweed is variable and it can provide too much iodine. Cases of iodine toxicity reported in scientific journals are often from excessive amounts of kelp and kelp tablets.

        Most iodine supplements are simply tablets made from kelp. Being a seaweed, kelp likely contains at least small amounts of arsenic. There are some very rare cases in which people taking kelp supplements have developed symptoms of arsenic toxicity (4).

        A survey of kelp supplements in the U.S. found that eight out of nine batches contained some level of arsenic (4). Another survey in the UK of imported seaweed found very little arsenic in kelp (5). It’s very unlikely that, taken at recommended amounts of 150 µg every other day, arsenic toxicity is likely to occur from kelp supplements.

        In 2017, a ConsumerLabs.com report found arsenic contamination in one of six supplements they tested in the U.S. However, they found too much iodine in many of the supplements and between this and the potential for arsenic contamination, it’s probably best to opt for a potassium-iodine supplement that isn’t from kelp.
        https://veganhealth.org/iodine/

        https://veganhealth.org/daily-needs/

  14. I just bought a person lifter. My cousin has started sliding out of chairs and out of bed. My grandmother did the same thing. Gentle slides and just landing on the rug, but can’t get up.

    Is it muscles that hold us in chairs and in bed?

    It isn’t that they were trying to get up. It is that they are slippery.

    I know they have wedges and straps for that and I am deciding on those, too, but I like the person lifter. It isn’t a hoya lift. It is something you sit on and put on the seat belt and it raises you up to chair height.

    I want him to get a fall alert pendant, but he doesn’t want ambulances showing up, and he doesn’t have a land line for the one you can use for free.

    I figured that I will be just like he is and I told him that it will be mine after he uses it.

      1. This is a common belief.

        However, in randomised ‘blinded’ trials people who use statins (but don’t know it) apparently have no more muscle pain than people taking a placebo.
        https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(17)31163-7/fulltext

        I suspect that your cousin may have a number of medical conditions which are perhaps more likely culprits for the muscle problems?

        The hullabaloo about statins we find all over the internet may condition people to expect more problems with statins On the other hand, that study was funded by drug companies so I am keeping an open mind on the matter.

        1. Tom,

          That is interesting. I did look up his med and it did list muscle wasting as a side effect, but I don’t know if he could prove it was that. Does Diabetes also cause muscle wasting?

          The doctor thought it was his statin, but it was because it was listed as a side effect.

  15. According to https://jacknorrisrd.com/arsenic-in-kelp-supplements/
    Wakame, kombu, and arame are all types of kelp.
    Kelp has had some problems with heavy metals (arsenic) & containing too much iodine & is not recommended as a source of iodine on veganhealth.org

    So is wakame safe?
    Would it be a safe way of raising potassium levels when one has a tendency to have low potassium despite eating potassium rich WFPB diet (probably a genetic thing)
    thanks!

    1. Wondering, that is a good question.

      The heavy metals is a huge issue for me. I have been undoing brain problems and I know that when I used Fiji Water to get rid of heavy metals it got rid of hallucinations and night terrors.

      I am going to be starting photobiomodulation again and I don’t want anything at all that might mess with my brain. I am a bit protective of it.

      I am in the middle of a major breakthrough where I can suddenly organize my house. I suddenly understand the concepts of the logic behind creating order. It is so hard to explain because I could always point to order versus disorder and understand it, but there was a serious executive function problem, plus almost a type of dyslexia about it. My closets are starting to look so much better.

      I think maybe before I would not know how to implement things, so I would buy storage containers but that part is supposed to come near the end, not at the beginning. Anyway, I can finally succeed at it.

      My coworker has offered to come in and help, but so far I have been doing it by myself trying to get brain plasticity about things. It is all helping.

      Infrared light therapy, the nasal light, the MicroPulse ICES PEMF, the use of brain wave understanding, broccoli sprouts and turmeric and blueberries and kale, lutein, and getting rid of heavy metals, lowering saturated fats, using Omega 3, getting enough Vitamin D3, taking steps to lower Homocysteine, etc.

      It is all working and I shift one thing at a time, so I get to see the benefit of each thing by itself.

      I am so happy even with Fiji water. I wonder if I can write to them and ask them to let the island have clean water to drink.

  16. Also, I read the latest study on Vitamin D and Omega 3 and it was frustrating because they didn’t use D3 and they didn’t tell which Omega 3 they used.

    The benefit for Omega 3 was only for those who were low.

    There was no benefit for D, but D3 is the one that studies show benefits and that is tremendously frustrating that they would use something else.

    I don’t trust researchers when they do that.

    1. YR,

      I laughed that they had people doing the macarena on the plane to Australia.

      It is a big deal on long plane trips. I can’t find the statistics, but I had looked it up about a year ago and it was so common that they gave a number of people who get them on long flights as if it happens every time.

      A man online had 2 friends fly to China and die of them.

  17. I am watching the infomercial for scalpmed for people with thinning hair.

    My friend has thinning hair and this method looks fascinating to me.

    It seems like it is mostly increasing the blood flow and nutrition to the hair follicles.

    The before and after photos are astounding.

    From bald to a full head of hair in about 5 months. Very full hair if people use it longer.

    It makes me wonder what genetics is doing and what increasing blood flow and nutrition undoes.

    Most baldness things look like a scam, but these before and after images are astounding.

    I am going to get my friend to try it and I will let you know.

  18. Bob,

    Perhaps……. It’s about the amount, which seaweed used and type of preparation. Keeping in mind that seaweeds have a high level of nutrient variability.

    So in reference to this issue see: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6551690/ The use of seaweeds is appropriate, but in moderation and dependent on preparation.

    Sorry it’s not a clean substitution for salt.

    Dr. Alan Kadish moderator for Dr. Greger http://www.Centerofhealth.com

    1. Thanks for the response!
      What I got from this article was that wakame by itself was healthful for me. So would it matter if I eat it on food or in a pill?

    2. The regular consumption of seaweed might lead to the presence of biochemically inactive B12 analogs into the bloodstream, trumping the analysis of B12 serum levels…

  19. I was reading an article on neutrophil adhesions affecting blood flow with Alzheimer’s and when I was looking for a way to understand the nutrition, I ended up back at EPA and DHA.

    When EC were supplemented with DHA, the levels of adhesion were reduced (Fig. 1B,D)

    https://academic.oup.com/jn/article/141/7/1331/4630658

    I am doing gadgets for blood flow and WFPB and some exercise and Omega 3, and I just am trying to understand the whole decreasing the adhesions thing.

  20. I have also been looking at Leptin Resistance, which is what they believe causes obesity.

    Sleep and circadian rhythms and not having estrogen already handicap me…

    But exercise and PEMF and infrared increase BDNF and those might improve it some.

    Also, lowering triglycerides.

    Do soy phytoestrogens help with leptin resistance?

    Do people who go WFPB still have it?

    If we have risk factors like lack of sleep, should we be looking at things like lectins to at least have some mechanisms for improving it?

  21. The actual test used in Japan was 5 ounces of dried wakame per day. The lowest price I found for wakame in bulk was 35 ounces for $35 or about $1 per ounce on Amazon. So that gets you an 8 to 10 drop in BP both sys and di for $5 per day or $150 per month. My Dr. used to say there are allot of things that drop BP a little, but not many that drop it allot.

    1. Correction….5 g per day was the amount of wakame used. 70 of wakame can be purchased locally here in WA State for $1.60. That is essentially a 2 week supply so the cost would be only $3.20 per month. So the price is very reasonable.

  22. Thank you for your comments on the price of wakame so others can explore how much they could anticipate once they explore in their area. Quite a difference which may be due to the fact WA is nearer the ocean(?) Perhaps shopping at an Asian market might be less expensive?

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