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Medical Associations Oppose Bill to Mandate Nutrition Training

Physician trade groups such as the California Medical Association came out in opposition of a bill requiring doctors get 7 hours of nutrition training anytime before 2017.

November 14, 2011 |
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Medical Associations Oppose Bill to Mandate Nutrition Training, 5.0 out of 5 based on 2 ratings

Sources Cited

View entire hearing at http://vimeo.com/23744792

Acknowledgements

Transcript

Given the fact that “7 out of 10 deaths among Americans each year are from chronic diseases.” Given that diet is a major factor. Given how inadequate nutrition instruction is in medical school, a California bill was introduced mandating physicians anytime before January 1st 2017 get, 12 hours of nutrition training. That was obviously too radical, so the bill was amended. How about, 7 hours? Who could possibly argue that doctors shouldn't get 7 hours of nutrition?

So the California Medical Association was opposed to mandating 7 hours of nutrition training for doctors, what about the California Orthopedic Association?

Frankly that didn’t surprise me; surgeons are not known for their passion for prevention. What about the California Academy of Family Physicians though? Surely they’re in favor of a few hours every 4 years on nutrition for family docs.

To see any graphs, charts, graphics, images, and quotes to which Dr. Greger may be referring watch the above video. This is just an approximation of the audio contributed by Peter Mellor.

To help out on the site please email volunteer@nutritionfacts.org

Dr. Michael Greger

Doctor's Note

Please feel free to post any ask-the-doctor type questions here in the comments section and I’d be happy to try to answer them. Be sure to check out all the videos on the medical profession.

For some context, please check out my associated blog posts: Nutrition Education in Medicine: a Doctor a Day Keeps the Apples Away, Health Food Store Advice: Often Worthless or Worst, and Watermelon For Erectile Dysfunction.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/mgreger/ Michael Greger M.D.

    Please feel free to post any ask-the-doctor type questions here in the comments section and I’d be happy to try to answer them. Be sure to check out all the videos on the medical profession, including today’s corresponding blog post Nutrition education in medicine: A doctor a day keeps the apples away.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/SusanBeterbide/ Susan Beterbide

    Outrageous!! But thank God the soda companies are putting calorie counts on their cans..so much for nutrition!

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/bpcveg/ BPC

    This attitude should be expected in a financially-driven system.

    After all, what money can be made if doctors teach there patients how to solve there own problems?

    • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/NickVanHorn/ Nick VanHorn

      A Bill Maher quote comes to mind:

      “You see, there’s no money in healthy people, and there’s no money in dead people. The money is in the middle: people who are alive, sort of, but with one or more chronic conditions that puts them in need of Celebrex, or Nasinex, or Valtrex, or Lunesta. Fifty years ago, children didn’t even get Type-2 diabetes. Now it’s an emerging epidemic, as are a long list of ailments that used to be rare, and have now been…mainstreamed. Things like asthma, and autism, and acid reflux, and arthritis, allergies, adult acne, attention deficit disorder. And that’s just the A’s. Doesn’t anybody wonder why we live with all this illness?”

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/DevinBousquet/ Devin Bousquet

    I love how soda companies are putting calorie counts on their cans. Wait… it’s been that way for years. Maybe they need to put “This drink has no redeeming nutritional qualities what-so-ever. It won’t even truly hydrate you” on the label.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/NinaGreif/ Nina Greif

    Who knew that learning how to stay in good health gets in the way of focusing on ones specialty! The public should be outraged at this. These people are signing death sentences for their patients. I’m a doc and I’m angry that I never learned how to heal people With chronic diseases.

    • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/drdons/ DrDons

      As a physician who gives educational talks to physicians on prevention and reversal of chronic diseases I find that most physicians welcome the information. It is sad that the important studies in this area are so unknown to physicians. The reality is that most of the information in this area has only started to emerge in the last 15 years or so. It’s hard for the older physicians to keep informed and the younger ones are not being taught in their training. Once the physicians start working in this area I believe they find it rewarding but difficult for many reasons. I’m sure you are familiar with some of these challenges as a physician. I had the privilege of testifying after Dr. McDougall in his support. We are hoping that his bill that was passed in a modified form will make a difference. In the meantime keep informed, talk to your colleagues, work with your patients… let’s make a difference! Best wishes.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/gfortcher/ gfortcher

    I’d like to propose a bill…Lets call the entire medical industry “Sick care” as opposed to health care…That seems to be what it is…health care is obviously left up to the individual to ferret out the correct answers. Thank you Dr G. for giving me some of the valuable resources to help me with that research.

    • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/bpcveg/ BPC

      gfortcher,

      You have made an excellent point, which is overlooked by most. The so-called “health care” is motivated solely by care of the sick with little to no emphasis/resources placed on the most important preventative aspect. Would love to hear more from Dr.G and other readers on this point.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/mike-quinoa/ Mike Quinoa

    Let’s see. The average man on the street knows more about nutrition than the average physician, and yet these associations balk at medical students receiving a mere 7 hours of formal nutrition education. What are they learning in the 4-years plus of med school which is so much more important or relevant? Call me jaded and cynical, but something is rotten in the state of California. The industries that would take a shot to the bottom line if people actually got well have very far-reaching tenacles, and they care more about their profits than your well-being. My sympathies to Dr. John McDougall (and Dr. Forrester and Senator Wright) on losing Round One, but I know he’ll be back.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/gfortcher/ gfortcher

    I really don’t think the average person knows more about nutrition than the average Dr. But, the person interested in good nutrition certainly does. I don’t believe the industry whould suffer from giving good advice. There would be plenty of non-listeners. And those that accepted good advice would eventually get old and natural system breakdowns would keep the industry busy. It would be a shift as to when sick care would be more necessary. It will probably take 20 yrs of education in our elementary schools and support of parents at home to grow a new generation of Healthy young people – lets call them generation “FV” for fruits and vegetables. I’d like to call them Gen Vegan…but I think that would be a stretch. The bottom line is that without a Dr. to ask our basic nutritional questions to, we are forced to take it upon ourselves. We turn to unknown sources for this info. We sift and dig. Hopefully we are right. Hopefully we stumble upon valid advice sites…like Dr. G.

    • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/mike-quinoa/ Mike Quinoa

      Hi gfortcher,

      Dr. Greger has a video re: the comparative nutritional savvy of John Q. versus our esteemed doctors, and I believe in fact, the great unwashed came out on top. Can’t remember which vid, or I would post a link.

      • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/gfortcher/ gfortcher

        Hello Mike Q. – I looked for the video you mentioned but I couldn’t find it either. Thanks for the info.

        • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/bpcveg/ BPC

          gfortcher:

          Follow the link below:
          http://nutritionfacts.org/videos/doctors-nutritional-ignorance/

          About half way through that video, reference is made to the comparison between the nutrition knowledge of doctors versus patients.

          • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/gfortcher/ gfortcher

            Hello BPVeg…thank you for the link.

    • http://www.facebook.com/teena.simon Teena Tibbetts Simon

      Perfectly said!

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/mike-quinoa/ Mike Quinoa

    Thanks for the link, BPCveg! I agree with you, gfortcher—it beggars belief.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/GalaChristen/ Gala Christen

    If the medical schools and associations cannot see the wisdom in this, it makes me doubt all their decisions and choices, as perhaps the best interests of the patients are left out of the decision-making process.

    “Let food be your medicine.” -Hippocrates

    • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/drdons/ DrDons

      Creating change in organizations is challenging. Most layered bureaucracies are designed to maintain status quo and are led by individuals who have no training in collaboration, leadership(as opposed to politics), and improvement techniques… that goes for front line physicians as well. Keeping up with latest in science is challenging. So I would keep tuned to Nutritionfacts.org and when interacting with health care professionals realize they probably don’t know much about nutrition and its use in preventing and stabilizing chronic diseases.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/wickedchicken/ wickedchicken

    How could we POSSIBLY ask these people to spend ONE HOUR AND FORTY FIVE MINUTES PER YEAR learning about nutrition?? Oh wait not even per year, after 4 years they would never have to learn about it ever again. But no, STILL, we are asking too much of these poor guys.

    • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/drdons/ DrDons

      Hi Wickedchicken, I give educational talks to physicians on the value of plant based diets. Most physicians are very receptive. Organizations as a whole are opposed to regulations of any type. The CMA represents less than 50% of physicians. Most upsetting to me was the opposition by the Family Medicine group. I am a Family Medicine physician although not a member of any FM organization, the CMA or the AMA for that matter. This type of reflex opposition to an excellent bill as drafted by Dr. McDougall is one of many reasons I’m not a member. The intent of the bill is still alive although it has been delegated to the Medical Board of California to decide whether information on nutrition should be included in medical education. Dr. McDougall and others(including myself) will be working next year to see what we can do. Wish us good luck.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/RebeccaCorby/ Rebecca Corby

    I love how she tries to imply that nutrition is such a special interest field not related to health ‘this kind of thing should be left up to individual physicians to decide if they want to learn about….this could start us on a slippery slope’ the redumblicans and lobbysists love that phrase I’ve noticed ‘slippery slope’ any kind of regulation to make business practices more ethical and provide the public with more honest information is labeled ‘ooooh a scary slipper slope, this will lead us down the wrong path’ AAHHH I’m sharing this on my facebook in hopes that ppl will wake up and see who really runs our country and makes laws and why they aren’t getting accurate advice from many doctors, thank you Dr. Greger you’re a hero for truth seekers

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/joel/ Joel

    My observation after living 68 years in the U.S: Aside from lip service, the medical industry has nothing to do with health, just as the music industry has nothing to do with creativity and the food industry has nothing to do with nutrition. There is no industry that is primarily structured for the benefit of the individual. Knowing this CLEARLY, whatever the field, is the first step. The second is taking control of your health or whatever it is you are now dependent on an industry for. The real answers (some of which are thankfully on this site) are everywhere except in the doctor’s office, the office of a record label CEO or the offices and pronouncements of the FDA, USDA, CDC, etc. Expecting nutritional or preventive advice from a traditionally trained MD is like taking your car to a wrecking yard for an oil change. This is dangerous conceptual confusion!

    • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/drdons/ DrDons

      Hi Joel, I was fortunate enough to be involved with Dr. McDougall in testifying on behalf of this bill which was eventually passed in a modified form. The modified form requires the Medical Board in California to address the issue. Stay tuned for how that turns out. I give talks to physicians on the application of lifestyle changes(i.e. mainly nutrition) to prevent, stabilize and reverse chronic disease. Most of the physicians are receptive but taking the information back to the office or incorporating it into their own personal lives requires a real shift in beliefs and behaviors. It is a certainly a challenge. In my opinion the solution is for the physicians to get exposed to the basic concepts and then have a way to keep up with the best current scientific information. I agree that individuals need to get the information and not rely on the medical profession. Nutritionfacts is a great resource for both healthcare professionals and individuals. Combining the information provided by Dr. Greger with information from other sources such as provided by John McDougall’s website provides current accurate science based information. Individuals can then help educate their doctors by setting good examples.

  • http://nutritionfacts.org/members/rjpeers/ rjpeers

    I am totally disgusted. Medical tradespeople untrained in nutrition have no idea what causes the common diseases of Western society. I once saw an inspiring article in the Australian Medical Journal–in 1955!!–titled Every Doctor A Dietitian. The author was a Sydney doctor who had charge of an orphanage, where he got the kids to eat whole-grain bread and to grow their own fruits and vegetables. He later found that these kids had the best teeth in the state. In 1990, I studied nutrition to find the cause of Alzheimer’s, and soon linked the disease with refined seed oils, which few people know are partly depleted in vitamin E. I went on to also connect these oils with ADHD, following seed oil consumption by the mother during pregnancy. But the really common diseases–diabetes, heart disease, tumours, arthritis, Parkinson’s etc–can be accurately traced to fatty diet (dairy, bakery and meat fats, and chocolate), which lowers cell membrane polyunsaturate levels, causing insulin resistance and oxidation. In addition, fatty maternal diet causes 1 in 4 Americans to be born anxious, and that leads to comfort-eating, alcohol and drug abuse, hypertension and depression, while also making a huge contribution to schizophrenia and bipolar disorder. A low-fat diet rich in grains and legumes will prevent and correct most such diseases, and the seed sugar Inositol–also found in citrus–actually has anti-ageing properties (see my video on YouTube–PEERS ANTI-AGING. Doctors with no nutrition are a public health hazard, and get few results with their drugs.

  • Valnaples

    Cannot BELIEVE the CMA stood UP for Coca-cola! Now THAT, that, my friends, is really a crime.

  • Tom Kouroukis

    Wow, educating physicians what a novel concept. In Ontario we as specialists are mandated to be able to document 400 hours of CME credits over each 5 year period.  I agree that nutritional training in medical school is nonexistent.  It is a shame that the majority of docs don’t know anything about nutrition and prevention other than what they read in the common media. Hopefully all those years of medical school training would help you to realize that a can of soda is bad irrespective of what they’ve put on the label.

  • Michael Greger M.D.

    For some context, please check out my associated blog post Nutrition Education in Medicine: a Doctor a Day Keeps the Apples Away!

  • jmerrikin

    Pathetic, utterly pathetic! I am in the middle of reading “Overdosed Amercia” by Dr. John Abramson and it is not only absolutely shocking, it gives a physician’s insider look at what medicine has become — a sad state of affairs geared toward driving profits into the pockets of pharmaceutical companies, politicians, lobbyists, and the vast majority of practicing physicians. Most people will never understand this. Millions of people will continue to be victimized by it. God forgive these people for what they do. 

  • Jenniferhopewebb

    The general training of doctors in regards to nutrition seems to be as follows: vitamin  deficiencies, anemias, albumin, tube feeding and baby formula requirements–with a few words about cholesterol and statins thrown in.  No offense meant toward the hard working docs of course.  As this video demonstrates, it’s a systems problem!

  • ahimsa

    follow the money… the food industry gives people junk, the pharmaceutical industry makes billions from people getting sick from that junk and the medical industry can only make more money from people getting sick. want to fix this sick cycle? promote a vegan diet…. get people healthy, the best thing anyone can do for the environment and end the suffering of billions of innocent beings. by the way research who really controls medical schools and their curriculums.

  • CoachCait

    7 hours is A LOT FOR TRAINING?!?!? You preposterous imbecile!!! EDUCATION IS THE BEST INVESTMENT IN ANY AREA, YOU TWIT!!!

  • Deb

    I wonder just how many of these doctors who say it is just too much are willing to go to training for a new procedure??

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100003280143255 Joe Smith

    Tell me if I am wrong but it says “CREDIT hours” not “hours”. Usually only 3 credit hours is one non lab course in college. So 5-6 months of class. I mean it is still nothing considering they are suppose to understand the human body. But hours and credit hours are different units of measurement.

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