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The Vitamin C Cancer Study that Started It All

In 1975, a remarkable case was reported of a 42-year-old man suffering from a malignant form of non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma who experienced a dramatic regression of the cancer after being given large doses of vitamin C intravenously, as I discuss in my video Intravenous Vitamin C for Terminal Cancer Patients. He seemed cured, so they stopped the vitamin C. The cancer came surging back. They restarted the vitamin C and apparently induced a second complete remission. Sometimes cancer does just spontaneously regress—it’s rare, but not unheard of. So, one could argue that the first remission was spontaneous, and it was just a coincidence that it happened when they started the vitamin C. However, given the trajectory the cancer was on, followed by the rapid remission, followed by the relapse when the vitamin C was stopped, followed by a second remission once restarted, the case strongly suggests that the vitamin C had something to do with the cancer’s remission.

Now, multiple spontaneous regressions do exist. There was a recent case, for example, of a woman with cervical cancer who appeared to be cured with radiation and chemo. Her cancer came back and she refused further treatment. Yet, the tumors disappeared on their own, then came back, then disappeared, then came back, then disappeared, then came back, and then disappeared for a fourth spontaneous remission—and all that was with no apparent treatment at all. So, it’s possible this vitamin-C case is just a crazy, coincidental fluke, and the vitamin C didn’t help at all. You never know until you put it to the test.

Researchers enlisted the help of Linus Pauling, who they considered the greatest chemist of the 20th century and who was known to be interested in vitamin C. If he couldn’t get funding, nobody could get funding. And he couldn’t get funding. They went to the National Cancer Institute with promising data on the first 40 cancer patients they had treated with vitamin C and asked that the institute carry out or fund a randomized double-blind trial. In this type of trial, they would take a group of incurable cancer patients for whom medicine has nothing more to offer, randomly split them into two groups, and infuse one group with vitamin C and the other group with something like saline, basically water, and then see who lives the longest. Neither the patients nor the doctors would know who got the vitamin C and who got the saline to eliminate bias and placebo effects. The researchers and Pauling went back year after year after year asking for grants to study it themselves if the National Cancer Institute wasn’t going to do it, and they got rejected year after year after year. So, they scraped up whatever funds they could find and did their best with what they had. They published their findings in 1976.

The researchers didn’t have a controlled trial, but, by that point, they had treated a hundred terminal cancer patients with vitamin C. So, they compared their progress to that of a thousand similar patients who did not get vitamin C. For each patient treated with vitamin C, the researchers found ten patients about the same age and with the same kind of cancer who had been treated at the same hospital but who had not received the vitamin C infusions. What did they find? In patients with terminal breast cancer, within a hundred days, more than 80 percent of the women in the control group were dead. (Remember, these were all terminal cancer patients.) However, in the vitamin C group, half were still alive nearly a year later. The vitamin-C group had women with terminal breast cancer still alive 2,270 days later and counting.

The control groups for all the different cancers studied did predictably poorly, with the vast majority dead within 100 to 200 days, while the vitamin C-treated patients appeared to do substantially better. All in all, the average survival time was four times as great for the vitamin C subjects—more than 200 days compared to only 50 days for the control patients. The results, the researchers concluded, “clearly indicate that this simple and safe form of medication is of definite value in the treatment of patients with advanced cancer.” So, what happened after the study was published back in 1976?

Critics understandably attacked the study for using after-the-fact controls. One can see how this could introduce bias. If researchers consciously or unconsciously chose control group patients who were sicker than the treatment group patients, the control group patients would die sooner than the treatment group patients, but it would have nothing to do with the treatment; the control group folks may have just started out in a worse place. Indeed, there is evidence that is what happened: A full 20 percent of the control group died within a few days after being declared terminal compared to none in the treatment group, which really does seem fishy. Nevertheless, the trial was successful in finally convincing the National Cancer Institute to fund randomized controlled trials—performed by the prestigious Mayo Clinic, no less. What did they find? Find out in Vitamin C Supplements for Terminal Cancer Patients and The Role of Vitamin C in the Treatment of Terminal Cancer.


I have tons of videos on cancer, but here’s a sampling:

In health,
Michael Greger, M.D.

PS: If you haven’t yet, you can subscribe to my free videos here and watch my live, year-in-review presentations:

Discuss

Michael Greger M.D., FACLM

Michael Greger, M.D. FACLM, is a physician, New York Times bestselling author, and internationally recognized professional speaker on a number of important public health issues. Dr. Greger has lectured at the Conference on World Affairs, the National Institutes of Health, and the International Bird Flu Summit, testified before Congress, appeared on The Dr. Oz Show and The Colbert Report, and was invited as an expert witness in defense of Oprah Winfrey at the infamous "meat defamation" trial.


58 responses to “The Vitamin C Cancer Study that Started It All

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  1. Countless examples across the healthcare industry show a reluctance to investigate anything which would obsolete the status quo protocols. Further, they will actively try to discredit anything demonstrated outside their control. There is also a pattern where any medical research that does get published will be embraced only if they can profit from it. Otherwise, it will likely be ignored. I’ve gotten to the point where I study what the medical establishment says just for information purposes, not because I ever expect them to acknowledge something works that they can’t profit from.

    Therefore, I have for 6 years been building my own off-line library, When I began my own journey with what seemed like a hopeless state of multiple chronic diseases (cardiovascular, cancer, and wildly out of control Ulcerative Colitis), Dr G was the foundation from which I constructed my nutritional plan. Now having converted to 100% WFPB diet, all signs of disease have vanished and UC medication has been reduced 87% (and counting). Dr G remains my go-to source on nutrition.

    In addition, recognizing the medical establishment’s willful ignorance regarding people like me who have experienced the potential of lifestyle medicine, I have begun accumulating files on the personal testimonies people share on-line of reversing seemingly every imaginable chronic disease naturally. When I started, I didn’t know a single person who did what I did. In fact, a medical professional recently told me she didn’t know anyone who was as far gone as me who made it back. Today, I see my case as rather routine for those who practice lifestyle medicine. And I frankly don’t give a crap if the medical establishment acknowledges the blindingly obvious.

    1. Congratulations on your fine recovery and ongoing study.

      It’s sad that most people get their nutritional advice from popular magazines, books, and TV ads and programs – all of which are more interested in selling things than helping people, and in not offending their money tap – advertisers who don’t give a flip about public health.

    2. Wow, thanks for sharing your recovery story with us, farmcountry. It is truly inspiring. I’m glad you’re still here with us. Keep up the good work, on your health & your offline library.

    3. farmcountry, thank you for your post. Many people are starting to realize that mainstream medicine has only one goal, making money.
      There are good doctors out there, but they are hamstrung by the threat of lawsuits if they do anything different than all the others.
      I can’t believe the Mayo Clinic researchers were so stupid that they didn’t know IV is not the same as oral. Was the study set to fail deliberately? I have to wonder.

      Dr. Gregor is to be commended for being willing to buck the pharmaceutical crowd.
      How much better would these people have done on a diet consisting mainly of high quality fruits and vegetables in addition to the IV vitamin C?

      1. The problem with all supplement studies is that placebo based studies can’t really prove if something works or not. An actual lab study has a better chance.
        As for vitamin C, humans have always had the ability to make it – regardless of what almost everyone believes. And equally contrary to popular belief, scurvy has zero to do with vitamin C – And Vitamin C has zero to do with preventing or curing scurvy – or the common cold (though most people have figured out C does not prevent colds).

    4. Farmcountry.
      Do you take any supplements in addition to the WFPB plan? How long did it take for this way of eating to reverse the issues you had?

      Thanks if you choose to reply.

    5. Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater.

      Most high level medical and scientific guidance acknowledges the primary importance of life style factors in disease prevention and management. A single example …..
      http://jaha.ahajournals.org/content/6/9/e006997

      And major scientific reports on nutrition, physical activity and health all recognise the importance of these factors. It is well worth reading these as well as major national guidelines produced in the US, UK etc. It is one reason why most countries issue national dietary guidelines – they are aware of the vital importance of nutrition in promoting human health. Ditto for exercise guidelines.

      Yes, these are not often put perfectly into practice – there is often too much conflict of interest especially in private for profit healthcare systems and acknowledgment of these factors sometimes idoesn’t extend much beyond lipservice. This may be why what the privateers call ‘socialised’ medical systems – where the for profit element is more controlled – appear to deliver much better healthcare outcomes than the US. in fact they are simply compulsory national health insurance schemes and the ‘socialist’accusation seems to come from those who make millions exploiting the sick and the dying (and the
      https://interactives.commonwealthfund.org/2017/july/mirror-mirror/

      For all its imperfections though, the medical establishment’s position (by which, I understand the formal position statements and gudiance issued by international and national bodies) seem well-grounded in the evidence. They respect the foundational importance of lifestyle factors in public health and medical management. Individual medical practitions ay indeed often ignore these. However, the danger of focussing on the system’s faults seems to me that it may encourage people to start believing the ‘plausible rogues’ who sell sensational books, magical cures and associated snake oil based on woo science and personal testimonials. The latter are hugely unreliable because we have no idea what other factors were involved in their individual cases. A number are fake anyway, invented to boost sales of products (I have seen a number of such fake testimonials here before they were deleted as spam). And if one person claims they cured cancer by going on a low fat WFPB diet and another claimed they cured it by going on a high fat low carb diet, where does that leave us?

      All in all, I tend to regard the evidence-based medicine approach to healthcare,in the way that Chuchill felt about democracy

      “Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others.”

    6. The medical establishment makes its money from sickness, not health. Your story is inspiring ~ best of luck to you.

      “Let food be thy medicine, and thy medicine be food.”

    1. Jan,

      You are right. He is teasing, and I have to say that most people probably won’t watch the videos and find out that the studies haven’t been done with the IV Vitamin C, even now. (And that the pills didn’t work, and that liposomal Vitamin C isn’t even on the radar for this.)

      I like that Dr. Greger has a stance to not jettison things, which might be useful and that he doesn’t just close his mind to alternative therapies and I also like that his mind isn’t so wide open that he errs in the other direction.

      Dr. Greger, most of them aren’t going to find out the answer, but you regularly reward the people who do the extra credit homework assignments.

  2. What I hate is that they aren’t giving Vitamin C IV, even if they do the other Cancer treatments!

    I love my dog’s vet, very much. He is the sweetest vet I have ever met and my dog LOVES going to the vet, as if I were taking him to a park.

    That being said, I have already found SO MANY things on PubMed and here, which can heal his Cancer and he didn’t mention even one thing. He told me to go home and start spoiling him with hamburger patties. I didn’t say, “Ain’t gonna happen.” I will explain how my dog got healed after things are finished.

    He didn’t say things like certain mushrooms will double the length of his life.

    I have been having a blast, because I have been going back to all of the animal studies and I am treating an animal.

    About two months from now, I will tell him, I had him on Maitake Mushrooms, which kills 3 lines of Canine Cancer. High doses of Flaxseed, which doubles length of life. Very low doses of soy – I am doing both Edamame and Tempeh organic with no sodium to fix his gut Microbiome. Nutritional Yeast and Barley – for Beta Glucan, because I love that pinch of Nutritional Yeast study from Japan very much. I am using Parsley, Sweet Potatoes, Pumpkin, Turmeric, Ginger, Decaf Green Tea, and am trying to get him to eat his Berries and Apples with the peel on, but he is inconsistent on that, for that reason, Berry Applesauce is what I am trying next. Honestly, I think he might have it in his jaw, because he doesn’t like chewing anything now, but I have blenders and immersion blenders and make my own supplement capsules for him.

    Yesterday, I thought it wasn’t going to work, because it seemed like he had a fever again, but, last night, he ate normally and today, he seemed normal again.

    I also got Frankincence and Myrrh essential oils. Haven’t decided how to use those yet, but they are a back-up, in case I can’t get my sweet, stubborn dog to eat his berries.

    I love this site.

    I love that I have learned so much that I can immediately go full steam ahead in trying to heal my dogs cancer and when I have gone to other sites, they all say give him meat and they would have him not eat some of the things, which cause apoptosis or some of the anti-angiogenesis foods. I talked with a friend about it and they are listening to other logic and I am trying to turn off the immortality of the cancer cells and I am trying to have his enzymes be available in his body to eat the cell wall covering off his cancer so his immune system can see it and I am trying to prevent it from going Tor and trying to starve it by Methionine restriction and trying to make sure he has enough fiber to help those good gut bacteria and I am starving those bad gut bacteria and preventing them from getting the choline and carnitine from animal products, so they can’t build anymore stupid tumors. I don’t know what the sweet potato proteins are going to do, but I am fond of n=1 studies.

    I don’t think I will ever meet you, but if you save my dog, I need to find a way to send you a hug.

    1. Deb

      Dogs make their own vitamin C – we humans don’t. That’s a big difference.

      There is no research to suggest that IV vitamin C is effective or safe for use in dogs and vitamin C can interfere with the effectiveness of anti cancer medicines.
      “What we found is that vitamin C blunted the effectiveness of all the chemotherapy drugs we studied,” says Mark Heaney, MD, PhD, associate attending physician at Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center in New York and the study’s lead author. “What vitamin C does is protect the cancer cells from the chemotherapy mainly by protecting their mitochondria [the cell’s power sources],” he tells WebMD.’
      https://www.webmd.com/cancer/news/20081001/vitamin-c-chemotherapy-bad-combo#1

      Your dog may well be better off without IV vitamin C.

      1. Thanks Tom!

        I didn’t know that and it is interesting to me.

        I am not doing IV. Vitamin C with him and the veterinarian recommended not to do surery or chemo, because it only buys a month or two for close to ten thousand dollars with all it entails and the animals suffer.

        I am using super foods and studies on pub med and ionized water. This site and The China Study and Dr Kelly and every dog study possible

  3. I watched the citrus peels video again and orange juice was correlated with a 60% increase in skin cancer or was that DNA damage toward skin cancer? I lost it, before I got back here. But the peels are protective? We are eating the wrong part.

    Pondering, because I like orange juice and I don’t drink it often, but that is fascinating to me.

    T. Colin Campbell was talking about lung cancer and skin cancer in the documentary, “Healing Cancer from the Inside Out” (free on Amazon Prime) and he said that something is off about our understanding of those two conditions, because the numbers don’t add up. He pointed out that people used to work outside all day long, without sun screen and now we stay inside and cover up and use sun screens to prevent tanning and everyone used to smoke, and now most people don’t smoke and yet skin cancer and lung cancer are going up, rather than down. He said that we blame things like pollution, but if we look at places like Okinawa, where people smoke more than anyone else, and where there is a lot of pollution, they didn’t get Cancer almost at all, until the Western diet was added in.

    He agreed that smoking and pollution and too much tanning are carcinogenic, but it doesn’t become a problem without our diets.

    So my orange juice and animal products may affect my having skin cancer just as much as my childhood Summers of sunburns and tans… but I will never know.

  4. I have searched the videos and blogs and can find no information about a particular type of cancer, carcinoid (neuroendocrine) cancer. Historically, it has been a rare (and also under-diagnosed) cancer, but it is on the rise. It can occur at different sites, but my husband’s carcinoid cancer is in his small intestine. I have been on a WFPB diet since he was diagnosed 7 years ago. After his surgery I started doing research about how to help him live a healthier life. The surgeon removed the tumor that was discovered on a scan, and a few others “upstream” and “downstream,” but he was left with an incurable “sugar sprinkling” of micro-tumors that you just live with and manage symptoms until something else happens. There are treatments for management, and research is being done, but there is no cure. My husband will not switch to a WFPB diet, and in some regards, he has a point because he (and other carcinoid gastrointestinal patients) tend to have major digestive issues. Beans and lots of vegetables cause cramping and diarrhea. Neuroendocrine tumors secrete hormones and histamines, so lots of things are going on systemically. The doctors and practitioners who specialize in this form of cancer don’t have much to say about nutrition for better health. It’s frustrating because I know my husband is not getting good nutrition. Sometimes he doesn’t eat at all for a day or more due to discomfort. Does anyone know of any research on diet for this type of cancer?

    1. texaspam Sorry to hear that you are going through this.

      It is so difficult when the people we love won’t go WFPB with us. Makes me worry about all of them.

      There might be a compromise diet. Dr. Fuhrman’s Eat to Live allows less than 10% of the calories to come from animal sources. He uses a lot of beans, but there are other things to eat. Pritikin allows some meat, too. There are other diets, which are reduced meat. With Cancer, I think Dr. Fuhrman said that 5% of calories from meat, Cancer stopped growing or even shrunk. Approaching 10% is when it started growing.

      I don’t know if that helps you or not. Fats are another thing associated with cancer.

      There are things like fecal transplants, which can often heal digestion issues by healing the gut. It sounds gross, but it is supposed to work and there are doctors who do it for a living. Insurance won’t pay for it yet. There is a web-site, which teaches how to DIY.

      I looked it up, because I have a few friends with such serious issues that they honestly could use one and if it was called something else, they might do it.

      I am bummed tonight about that, because I have been feeding my dog, who has seriously advanced cancer, my own foods all week, but I messed up tonight. I had bought some cans of Halo low glycemic vegan dog food, for when I am running too late to make him something and to ensure nutrition, and I pulled a can out and opened it and fed him and it turned out to be a can from the Vet, which was a can of Blue with chicken and I am so frustrated with myself, because my dog started looking better today and I can’t even handle that my vet gave me 3 cans of dog food and I didn’t get rid of them.

      I am also evaluating that mushrooms need to be heated, but this person said that if you refrigerate them after heating them that they get the toxins again: http://www.dldewey.com/foodsno.htm

      Leftovers just became an issue. So did peanuts. Twice in two days, peanuts became an issue. I heard an interview about the fungus on peanuts causing cancer and I also read a pubmed article that they can increase IGF1 and can cause tumors to metastasize. I feel like I learn 100 new things per day, but that sometimes information is competing and it is so challenging to process it.

    2. In the case studies on this page, there is someone who had a neuroendocrine cancer who I think gets a fecal transplant by the end. It is a long analysis, which I stumbled on after reading your comments.

      https://ccforum.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13054-015-0738-7

      They do have pages on-line with dietary recommendations, but I know that most of them don’t recommend WFPB even as an ideal, as if they don’t know about it.

      https://ccforum.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13054-015-0738-7

    3. Pam

      I do noit think there is any well-grounded research on this type of cancer and dietary management.

      However, you could consider a methionine restricting diet
      https://nutritionfacts.org/video/starving-cancer-with-methionine-restriction/

      And also increasing consumption of specific anticancer vegetables like spinach and sweet potatoes
      https://nutritionfacts.org/video/anti-cancer-potential-of-sweet-potato-proteins/
      https://nutritionfacts.org/video/1-anticancer-vegetable/

  5. People might find it usefult to read the Linus Pauling Institute summary of the current evidence on vitamin C and cancer
    http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/mic/vitamins/vitamin-C#cancer-treatment

    I also found this Medscappe article interesting

    “What vitamin C does is protect the cancer cells from the chemotherapy mainly by protecting their mitochondria [the cell’s power sources],”
    https://www.webmd.com/cancer/news/20081001/vitamin-c-chemotherapy-bad-combo#1

    1. Tom.

      Thanks. You are always good at being useful.

      I ended up listening to an interview on Chris Beat Cancer with Dr. John Kelley and it encouraged me tonight as I accidentally gave meat-based dog food to my dog.

      For those who don’t know, he is a doctor who encouraged all of his patients to try the principles of The China Study for a few months and wrote a book about the results. He said that all of the patients who tried it had their Cancer stop growing and they all lived. The ones who cheated too often and veered from it died. He said that there is margin for error, because most of the cells of the body use the animal proteins and it is just the excess animal proteins, which cause the Cancer to start
      growing again. He didn’t have problems with people in his groups eating fish occasionally and said that all of his patients kept eating fish occasionally and the ones who were mostly plant based with some fish still are alive. (I know that toxicity is the biggest issue with fish, and that probably won’t get smaller as the oceans get more polluted, but for the people who can’t go all the way to WFPB, fish might be the better thing to hold onto, if you need to hold onto something.) I am not holding onto meat, but my dog, eventually might get some. Not sure yet. He has such a big tumor and I know Dr. Greger did have studies where fish was linked to things. If I can stop the tumor, it is still basketball size, is what the vet said. I think it was more a big melon size, but I am not good at concepts like that.

      http://hwcdn.libsyn.com/p/8/f/d/8fd05aa27cc4b600/CBC_-_with_John_Kelly.mp3?c_id=15384300&cs_id=15384300&expiration=1529039594&hwt=e148842671d7bf24d500c4e0d0c4b363

  6. I am glad that you haven given facts regarding Vitamin C. I am a proponent of high doses of Vitamin C to “bowel tolerance”. I no long take unsafe flu shots. I have learned about orthomolecular medicine that has been used by doctors for many years and have treated patients with vitamin C, Niacin, etc. All of this has been documented but Big Pharma has been against supplements for treatment which is safe and has no side effects and is cheap!

    1. Tom,

      I understand what you are saying and when I look at your link, there are things like Vitamin C helping affect some Cancers by affecting H. Pylori, rather than a cure for something on its own,

      I think that most Cancer patients who have a “death sentence” try everything and it is one of the things and it might help a little, with some of the risk factors, is the answer, but it is less expensive than some of the medical methods, which might only help a little, also.

      Dr. Kelly talking about getting rid of animal products really encouraged me, last night and ENCOURAGEMENT is more precious than gold, walking through a Cancer process.

      Going through this with my dog, I might have put him down, even after everything I have learned this past year and a half and he is acting normal already within a week, even with my “meat mishap” and today, he ate apples with the peels on and I celebrated antiproliferation and re-watched the apple peels video and the tumor shuts off the tumor suppression gene off and apple peels turn it back on and I give Dr. Greger a symbolic hug and thank him for encouraging me, because I got my dog to eat so many vegetables today and only one fruit, but it was apples with the peels on and I don’t have anyone around me who would get excited that my dog ate apple peels today. I couldn’t sneak a strawberry in. Sweet potato proteins are flooding his system and I am getting the turmeric in and I am getting the flax in and a pinch or two of nutritional yeast and a few servings of soy and a tiny bit of ginger and parsely and Maitake Mushrooms.

      He is getting better.

      Stronger.

      He was at death’s door, needing to be carried into the vet exactly a week ago and he couldn’t breathe properly and couldn’t stand up and wouldn’t eat anything at all and had a mass the size of a basketball, but this site encouraged me and I feel so confident that I am healing my dog of Cancer and I still haven’t told the vet that I have him on lower glycemic index vegan dog food and super foods, and he will hear it and warn me about cachexia and I am not afraid at all, he told me to just feed my dog as much as he asks for and my dog is asking for food all the time now. He has lost all of his disciplines and is used to getting spoiled already.

      1. On top of that, I am losing over a half pound every day – easy peasy.

        Both things are easy peasy.

        Listening to an interview with Dr. Kelly, he said that when T. Colin Campbell helped solve a case with kids who were getting liver cancer, it turned out to just be “stop eating the peanuts with the aflatoxins” and Dr. Kelly was remarking about how easy it turned out to be and I am so struck by that.

        I have done so many diets in my life and would wrestle up all of my will power and would count all the calories and add up all the nutrients and keep logs of all the foods and emotions and study everything and now, I am just eating.

        Tonight, the news talked about Yale talking about how if foods both are high fat and have refined carbs, they overstimulate the brain.

        And, this site has overstimulated me quite a bit, but food doesn’t do it for me anymore.

        1. https://www.independent.ie/entertainment/books/book-reviews/book-review-the-dublin-doctor-who-is-beating-cancer-30796329.html

          Hi Deb

          Just make sure that you keep ‘vegan’/mock meats, burgers etc away from your dog. Soy protein isolate raises IGF1 perhaps even more than dairy foods. IGF1 is a growth promoting factor and is thought to be associated with spurring cancer growth. All these vegan burgers, sausages etc and mock meats are made from soy protein isolate.

          McDougall explains the issue here

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHYFOJBU434

  7. Oh, and that was what I was going to say.

    “Believing extraordinary claims….”

    Here is the thing.

    Scientifically, I am glad when they figure out that something isn’t just placebo effect, but I also seriously believe in the power of the placebo itself. It is doing something versus doing nothing.

    Some of these studies, the sugar pill had 25 to 35% improvement.

    Improvement, from believing in hope enough to try is better than the “noseebo” effect, which Flint Rehab warns stroke patients to not buy into. That is “Don’t believe anything and don’t get anything.”

    People’s hair felt out from placebo effect, when they thought they had chemotherapy.

    How powerful is that?!?!

  8. People’s hair felt out from placebo effect, when they thought they had chemotherapy.

    I say that again, because who knows how much cortisol or SOMETHING might have been released out of the stress of that procedure.

    I watched a video of a woman who had a series of videos after being diagnosed with Stage 4 bone cancer. She said that she had both of her breasts removed from Stage 2 cancer earlier and didn’t know that she would have such serious PTSD after that experience. Fear and stress and anger for years and years after. Then, she got it again in her lymph nodes and went through surgery and torment again. Quality of life was pretty low.

    But looking at her after trying the different cancer protocols: things like Budwig and Cesium Chloride protocol and changing her diet to include lots of fruits and vegetables, the transition was astounding, and she is cancer free. I know it is genuine, not an internet ploy. You watch her walking through over years and her early videos were a dejected, depressed human being in a dark room and her videos from 6 months after the stage 4 Cancer diagnosis, after trying every natural cancer protocol she could think of….

    She looked peaceful and happy and whole.

    I feel that way already with this process, and I am not at my ideal weight yet. It is zooming down to that and if I could fast forward and put comments here next year, they would be from a different person than a year ago.

    Hope is everything.

    1. That’s dine Deb but was it the hope, the plenty of fruits and vegetables she started eating, the caesium chloride or the standard cancer treatment that she may or may have been receiving, that was responsible for her improvement? We don’t know.

      Testimonials can also be highly misleading. Consider if 1,000 people with cancer independently try a oarticular alternative ‘cure’. If 998 die and 2 survive, you can be sure that you will see enthusiastic testimonies by those two survivors claiming that it was their alternative cure that was responsible for their survival. We would never know about the other 998.

      My concern is that all these extravagant claims about alternative cancer cures may cause people to refuse proven conventional treatment

      ‘Cancer patients who initially chose alternative medicine therapies as the sole treatment for their cancers were more than twice as likely to die compared with patients who chose to undergo conventional cancer treatment, a US study has found.1 The study was published by JNCI: Journal of the National Cancer Institute.’
      https://www.bmj.com/content/358/bmj.j4006

      That said, improving the diet and undertaking exercise as complementary therapies do seem to improve survival
      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5181206/
      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2841550/

      1. Tom,

        I understand, and putting that information out is a good thing.

        People have big decisions to make and I would always want it to be with the most information possible.

        Dr. Kelly did say that using the almost WFPB diet actually worked better with the people who didn’t do chemotherapy. Possibly, because improving the immune system works better if you aren’t killing the immune system at the same time, but I think about the combinations differently, maybe than the studies.

        For instance, the flax seed study with the muffins, which started shrinking the tumor between biopsy and surgery. As a woman, I would never just go straight to surgery if I could shrink the tumor with a muffin every day first. I think one of the studies said that it shrunk tumors by as much as 63%,

        Same thing with the Cesium high PH protocol, it relieved the pain within 72 hours and was shrinking the tumor within 2 weeks.

        The Beta Glucan in a pinch of Nutritional Yeast doubled recovery times or people with inoperable cancers.

        Dandelion tea healed some cancers after the patient had received all the treatment medicine could give and they are studying how to make it into a medicine.

        Soy – organic, non-salted, in small enough doses to not turn on growth hormone in a study where they were trying to cause metastases in mice, the non-soy group ended up with 11 plus tumors in almost every animal and the soybean group only ended up with one or two tumors.

        Kangen water even – just having their mice who was given a tumor drink high alkaline water versus tap water – the Kangen water mouse had a tumor the size of a skin tag and the other mouse had a tumor the size of the mouse itself.

        I am not against traditional medicine, but no matter what I would be taking two or three weeks and would be shrinking it as much as possible and verify it on a thermogram. Then, at least have the surgery maybe have margins.

        The anti-angiogenesis power alone of foods like soy, citrus, garlic, onions, pumpkin, sweet potatoes, parsley, turmeric, ginger, flax seed, apple peels, berries, is mind-boggling.

        I am going to find out if it shrinks my dog’s tumor and his tumor was so big that a month from now, when I pay for another x-ray, I really will see it with my own eyes. The vet doesn’t think he will live more than a month, but I see a dog getting stronger, and in less pain, not weaker.

        Tom, I guess I feel like the superfood synergy studies haven’t even been started yet and I am doing an n of 1 study, because the vet said that surgery would cost $6000 and many dogs die on the table if they are weak and surgery, plus chemo only would buy me another month or two and mushroom studies already would buy me the same amount. So would a pinch of Nutritional Yeast.

        I feel so confident right now, because my dog couldn’t even move and now he is begging to go to work with me and I promised the vet that I wouldn’t take him and I haven’t, but he is back to his old self in one week.

        A month from now, I will verify it, but it might have already worked.

        1. I hope it works for your dog. Your initial results seem very encouraging..

          Diet and exercise would certainly be my first/automatic choice as a response to a cancer diagnosis. Then I would have to seriously consider the conventional treatments in the context of the particular cancer and what the evidence shows.

          I am wary of testimonials alone for all the reasons I have explained previously.

      2. Tom,

        My family and friends don’t believe in Whole Food Plant Based at all.

        Not even for weight loss.

        They don’t believe in healing diseases with nutrition at all.

        They think all of the on-line doctors are con artists, including Dr. Greger and Dr. McDougall and Dr. Barnard and T. Colin Campbell.

        They think the studies are faked.

        Or are more like statistics lie from whichever direction you want them to lie from.

        I not only believe in these doctors, I believe the chiropractors are sincere, too and that so are most of the Cancer doctors and people like Chris and Green Smoothie Girl.

        I am not worried about being conned.

        I am worried about not putting in enough effort and not finding the information that is out there.

        I watched the movie Lorenzo’s Oil and I love that family. They just loved their son and kept trying to figure it out.

        I feel like it is like mountain climbers looking for the slightest hand and toe hold.

        A person has asked Dr. Greger a few times what his IQ is and my IQ is “passionate”

  9. I watched another video of a young woman with Cancer who was in her twenties and she flew to a place where she could be put out of her misery.

    The contrast to what I am feeling right now is astounding.

    I know a few people who killed themselves, because of Cancer.

    More than one is too many.

    And I watch “Healing Cancer from the Inside Out” and want to go back in time and say, “No, could we just start with: here eat an apple with apple peels on it.”

  10. I ended up looking up the cesium and it is about high ph therapy. It is one of the protocols the woman with Stage 4 cancer in the bones used. It makes me feel sad about The PH Miracle person being in prison. He was healing people. Our stupid country lets so many scoundrels do so many things, but will put a man in prison who has before and after Pet Scans and such good photos of the PH working.

    “In 1984, Dr. Brewer published “The high pH therapy for cancer tests on mice and humans” in Pharmacology Biochemistry and Behavior (Vol. 21, Supplement 1).

    Mass spectrographic and isotope studies have shown that potassium, rubidium, and especially cesium are most efficiently taken up by cancer cells. This uptake was enhanced by Vitamins A and C as well as salts of zinc and selenium. The quantity of cesium taken up was sufficient to raise the cell to the 8 pH range. Where cell mitosis ceases and the life of the cell is short. Tests on mice fed cesium and rubidium showed marked shrinkage in the tumor masses within 2 weeks. In addition, the mice showed none of the side effects of cancer. Tests have been carried out on over 30 humans. In each case, the tumor masses disappeared. Also, all pains and effects associated with cancer disappeared within 12 to 36 hours; the more chemotherapy and morphine the patient had taken, the longer the withdrawal period. Studies of the food intake in areas where the incidences of cancer are very low showed that it met the requirements for the high pH therapy.”

  11. Young is a convicted felon who preys on the sick. His claims have no scientific basis and he himself has no real qualifications – he apparently bought his ‘qualifications’ from a since-closed diploma mill.
    https://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/young3.html

    The alternative health blogosphere is a happy hunting ground for con artists like this. As for the Ph diet claim, Dr Greger has already examined the alkaline water and alkaline diet theories

  12. Tom,

    I am not sure whether he is a con artist or someone who believes what he was saying. I say that, because I saw the before and after labs and photos of his patients and many of them were healed by alkalizing their diets. I remember that one had a tumor the size of a grapefruit on their neck, which was gone 6 weeks later.

    He did not have the right to treat Cancer patients by the law in America, which does not allow anyone other than a medical doctor to treat Cancer at all, but from what I listened to, most of his patients came there after having tried everything else, and I saw enough successes in his presentation to have a more merciful perspective about him than you have.

    I have seen other people who are pure con artists who had people drink toxic things and skipped off to Mexico to avoid the law and things like that and my friends always seem to be trying those concepts and I always seem to be looking at food concepts.

    I did watch Dr. Greger’s Alkaline videos and that is partly what confuses me about what the pet food industry is saying about animals needing to eat animal products to avoid cachexia. His video, cachexia is what happens in response to a lifetime of eating meat. The muscles give up calcium to protect the body PH. Their logic is that a low protein diet is what leads to cachexia.

    As far as the ionized water, I don’t mind people making money off of machines or people making money off of the bottled water version, as long as there really is ionized water in it.

    Can I just use baking soda and put it in my dog’s dish?

    I am not doing that, because I am trying to keep track of the PH, because I want it around the PH, which the mice with the tiny tumor had. I don’t want to accidentally make him too alkaline and have a bacterial overgrowth problem from that direction.

    T. Colin Campbell was all I needed. He was doing animal studies and removing animal proteins and tumors shrunk. That is already a good enough concept for me.

    I don’t know how many weeks to do the high alkaline water, but tumors were shrinking by two weeks, so I am thinking a month or two at the most.

    I don’t want to err too much in the other direction, because I already removed the acid meat products. I just want to shrink the tumor, if I can.

  13. I am not a conspiracy theorist about people like him getting arrested. I just did see enough genuine healings, which came after all hope was gone, that I feel like people like him give people the next thing to try.

    If his products didn’t have the right ingredients or if his science was based on lying studies or if he had people take something toxic, then I would be the first to say, “Con artist” but I saw him as someone to extended hope after it was already over and he won enough that I didn’t want him locked up.

  14. I watched the movie by that group of chiropractors, which are parallel to the doctors in many ways and I genuinely found them all sincere and it felt like watching “What the Health” or “Eating You Alive” and they were using many of the same studies that you could read from Dr. Greger or Dr. McDougall or Dr. Barnard or Dr. Ornish.

    Except that I feel safer now, because I already did my first round of the internet and have seen things from so many sides and I genuinely like this group of doctors better.

    That being said, when my step-mother had a stroke, I pondered stroke and it is the chiropractors who would allow me to do the brain plasticity things that I saw in PubMed and on TedTalks. The doctors aren’t doing any of it and often are doing the opposite.

    As a person who wants the right to choose my own logic, I have a soft spot for the chiropractors, but you will notice that it is a doctor reading studies that I listen to the most.

  15. I think the part that I ponder, Tom, is that I am trying high alkaline with my dog and that man in prison is the one who said enough that I have this concept. No doctor or vet or anyone else ever in my life has said it.

    I do like that there are agencies to protect us, but when my mother had Cancer, they knocked her into a coma with morphine, while she was saying, “No, please, no morphine.” and she wanted to try to live and kept insisting that she wasn’t in pain. We got her off of it and had her wake up and still not want morphine and still say she wasn’t in pain. And they called us abusive and said, “Why do you want her to be in pain.” and we said, “Why aren’t you listening to her.” and pointed out that we were there every day and night interacting with a peaceful mother who was still her same old personality and they stole her ability to communicate with that drug and she hated it and medicine is taught in a way where people don’t get the right to their own opinions and I don’t even know what will change that, but I liked the chiropractors for pointing to things that I saw and standing up against it and so do the WFPB doctors. They killed my mother with end of life meds, while she was trying to fight to live. They did the same thing to my uncle and tried to do it to my grandmother, but I took her home.

    I would choose WFPB and not have chemo or radiation or surgery, because I would be excited to see if I could do it with diet and I have such dreadful memories of medical. I would rather die trying it the way T. Colin Campbell did than be forced into a system, which doesn’t listen to the patients.

    And, yet, yes, I know you are right that people who do both probably have greater successes, but how many people are thinking they are treating Cancer and are doing supplements, which kill them faster?

    There are things like that, which I would like taken out of the equation before I do the math, but the people doing it the natural way still seem happier and more positive and enough of them live that I would choose WFPB and the super foods again and again, even if I failed.

  16. The documentary “Healing Cancer from the Inside Out” had a place, which was nutrition oriented and they were talking about how almost all of their patients came after they had exhausted medical avenues and they have an extraordinary amount of success.

    I am so passionate about learning all of this, because I believe in it already.

    I am laughing, because I still read the web site of a few people calling T. Colin Campbell a con artist, but, then I listened to Dr. Kelly using it in his Cancer practice in Ireland and I believe in it enough to be doing it, while my friends believe that my dog will get cachexia and, if I am wrong, my dog dies, and everybody wanted me to put him down a week ago and he is his old self already and I have no idea if that means the Cancer is better.

    I love the high alkaline study that the pain in the humans went away in 72 hours. Maybe it is just that he isn’t in pain anymore. The first days, he couldn’t get up and now he is hounding me down looking for sweet potatoes.

  17. Trying to understand cachexia. That is why they don’t want dogs to go on vegan diets for cancer.

    Okay, acid from meat causes some muscle loss over time.

    Then, there is cachexia related to tumors, which start before the tumors are clinically detectable. Then, the tumor actively promotes tissue wasting.

    https://www.nature.com/articles/oncsis20163

    “For a long time, cachexia has been merely considered an epiphenomenon of end-stage tumors. However, in specific tumor types, such as pancreatic cancers, it is now clear that patients present markers of tissue wasting at a stage in which tumor is not yet clinically detectable, and that host amino acid supply is required for tumor growth. Indeed, tumor cells actively promote tissue wasting by secreting specific factors such as parathyroid hormone-related protein and micro RNAs.”

    Also inflammation causes it.
    Unlike starvation, which primarily affects fat tissue, skeletal muscle is the major target of wasting in cachectic patients, suggesting a different signaling pathway targeting muscle loss.10 However, even though the main tissue affected by cachexia is the skeletal muscle, cachexia cannot be reduced to a muscle-wasting syndrome. Indeed, several other organs such as liver, heart, fat tissue and brain are affected, making cachexia a true multi-organ syndrome.11

    To provide a clear definition of the molecular and metabolic determinants of tissue wasting, it is vital to apply a systemic approach in defining the contribution of each single organ to the cachectic process and to understand the role of tumor in this process and the interplay between the two compartments.

    Indeed, although cachexia is a metabolic disorder characterized by tissue wasting, resistance to anabolic signals and an overall catabolic state, cancers, on the other side are highly proliferating and energy-demanding tissues.12 Consequently, the metabolic alterations present in cachectic patients results in a negative energy balance and into the release of nutrients in the bloodstream, further supporting tumor growth.11

    Therefore, it is important to investigate the interplay between these two compartments and to understand how cancers promote this pathologic state to foster its own progression.

    Immune system
    Inflammation is a double-edged sword in cancer. Aside from the natural role of immune system in controlling tumor growth, ultimate cancer cells hijack the immune system to produce specific cytokines promoting tumor growth, survival and progression.13 Chronic inflammation is also a major driver of cachexia (Table 1), as it affects the function of several tissues such as skeletal muscle, fat, brain and liver.14 Indeed, several pro-inflammatory cytokines promote cachexia: tumor necrosis factor alpha (TNFα), interleukin-6 and -1 (IL-6/IL-1) and interferon gamma.15″

    I still don’t understand why they are using this argument as pro-meat, rather than an anti-inflammatory diet?

    Okay, here it is: They think you need more IGF1 and argue against getting rid of meat to get rid of Cancer, but, since I believe Dr. Barnard, I am thinking getting the fat out of my dog’s pancreas is what will change the insulin resistance.

    “Indeed, it has been reported that during cachexia, both cancer patients and mouse models, experience a decrease in the circulating levels of the anabolic factor insulin-like growth factor-1 (IGF-1) and the development of insulin resistance.”

    “Insulin resistance has been recently modeled in a tumor model of drosophila. In this animal model, insulin signaling was disrupted by the expression of ImpL2, an insulin growth factor binding protein that inhibits both insulin and IGF-1 signaling.54, 55 ImpL2 was produced directly by different tumor types, promoting peripheral organs insulin resistance and therefore systemic tissue wasting,54, 56 a phenomenon likely present also in cancer patients.57 Interestingly, in the drosophila model, insulin/IGF-1 signaling was upregulated in cancer cells, thus allowing to benefit of the systemic hyperglycemia.55 Further studies will be required understand the relevance of this mechanism in patients.

    At the cellular level, three main degradation pathways have been described in skeletal muscle to account for protein degradation”

    Way over my head, but I have learned enough science to hear, “blah, blah, blah glycolosis. blah, blah, blah electron transport chain.” etc. I actually recognize a lot of words now.

    I found the insulin part interesting. I still like Dr. Barnard’s get the fat out of the pancreas as how to fix the insulin thing, but I understand why they are following the opposite logic.

    “Insulin has several metabolic activities that can affect tumor progression.155, 156 The increase in insulin level, as it happens in the onset of insulin resistance, per se promotes directly tumor growth by acting as growth factors. Coherently, several tumors overexpress the insulin receptor and IGF-1 receptor.157, 158 However, insulin resistance can also promote tumor growth indirectly by modulating host metabolism in at least two independent manners. On one side, as insulin is an anabolic factor that normally blocks protein breakdown and promotes protein synthesis;159, 160 insulin resistance (and similarly IGF-1-resistance) might promote muscle wasting, hence, amino acid mobilization into the circulation, potentially fueling cancer. On the other, insulin signaling impairment also promotes liver gluconeogenesis,161 further increasing REE, tissue wasting and ultimately fueling cancer aerobic glycolysis.”

  18. They are afraid of lowering IGF-1, because of it being low in Cachexia.

    I am afraid of it being high, because I am more focused on wanting to not have the tumors grow.

  19. There was another sentence in the link about Mitochondria damage. That is why the Paleo lady started adding in the bright colored fruits and vegetables and getting her nutrition in order. I didn’t go Paleo, and don’t want to, but she talked about healing Mitochondria and seems to have succeeded. I took NT Factor, for that. I am wondering if I can re-watch her video of how she healed her Mitochondria and do a WFPB version for my dog.

    Yes, I stop at the sentences I understand and try to learn something and feel like I do eventually. Clearly, I am not going to be going to medical school any time soon, but that lady really did heal her mitochondria enough to walk.

    It is interesting that mitochondrial damage and insulin resistance come up in a Cancer conversation anyway.

    It is all ten thousand miles over my head, but I still have to just do my best and make decisions.

    Everybody has to make decisions whether they understand things or not.

  20. I hate teasers. Please give all of the pertinent information in one article and don’t make us click again to get the “final results!”

  21. I ended up reading about the other Dr. Kelley on The Cancer Tutor today. I know that the enzyme pills study based on his work didn’t succeed effectively, but I remember him using nutrition and when I got to the middle of it, they said he was against high doses of Vitamin C, because it messes up with enzymes. I found it interesting reading it, because it was talking about topics, which I was pondering from the cachexia article.

    “Dr. Kelley and his practitioners treated more 33,000 patients, claiming a 93 percent success rate for those who came to him before — not after — chemotherapy, radiation, or surgery. For those with a predicted life expectancy of about three months, he said that a well-designed nutritional program would yield “slightly better than a 50-50 chance of survival.” For those with a very advanced disease, given less than three months to live, he claimed a success rate between 25 and 35 percent.

    Dr. Kelley talked of the pancreas as being one of the main organs in defense of cancer. Why would he say that? The pancreas works with the liver to regulate insulin (a hormone) and it produces many enzymes (more than 30) and some of them dissolve protein, such as those on the outside of cancer cells. Dr. Kelley learned this perspective from the famous embryologist John Beard, who worked at the University of Edinburgh at the turn of the 20th century. He first proposed in 1906 that pancreatic proteolytic enzymes, in addition to their well-known digestive function, represent the body’s main defense against cancer.

    Dr. Kelley, and Beard before him, believed to defeat cancer you don’t create some new method of defense that does not mimic the human body, you create a method of defense that acts like the human body, and the body uses pancreatic proteolytic enzymes in the natural fight against cancer. What makes enzymes function well in the body are trace minerals and hormone balance, so Dr. Kelley provided support for both in his program. Dr. Kelley always said you have to bring the body back to homeostasis; that does not entail large dosages of strange items being put into the body. What does he mean by that?

    High-dose Vitamin C can disrupt enzyme function. That is why Dr. Kelley did not use high dose Vitamin C. He did believe the body needed plant enzyme function, so he endorsed and recommended high-dose juicing of specific vegetable combinations, and he worked to rebuild the glandular function of the body with glandular supplements, until the body could provide its own glandular support.

    Dr. Kelley saw a close correlation between diabetes and cancer and treated both in a similar fashion. Anyone who came to Dr. Kelley with cancer often had diabetes, and both were cured with his program. Dr. Kelley believed you had to detox very aggressively. He believed you could not aggressively kill cancer cells in a body already full of toxins or you contributed to a state of cachexia.

    1. Deb

      Kelley was a dentist (not an MD) whose dental licence was withdrawn. His treatment was ineffective and had a higher mortality rate than conventional treatment, whatever he may have claimed and whatever cranks with websites may say.

      Check out the Wikipedia article on Dr William Kelley.

      Note that the Irish physician Dr John Kelly is a completely different person

  22. I just did a journey from Ted Talk on the metabolism of Cancer using Pyruvate Kinase M2 and it making lactic acid versus energy to a program about a little boy put on a soy based carbohydrate free ketogenic diet, which saved his life, because he had a problem with Pyruvate Kinase.

    It made me look up ketogenic diets and cancer and, no, I am not jumping off WFPB, but PubMed with mice with metastatic cancer living 50-something percent longer if they were given Ketone supplementation, even if their diet was not restricted or had high glucose.

    I am laughing, because I already have a double survival rate with the mushrooms and nutritional yeast, but I suddenly am pondering if there is a way of adding Keto in. I looked up Ketogenic supplements and it listed flaxseed oil as a Ketogenic supplement.

    I am trying to do the math, because in one study, it wasn’t the A1C level linked to Cancer, and they said insulin resistance increases growth hormone? If I am understanding the sentences.

    I haven’t put him on flaxseed oil, because I am trying to see if Dr. Barnard’s low oil diet will do the whole unclog the pancreas thing.

    I have been using flaxseed itself. Is flaxseed a Ketogenic supplement? Or is it just the oil?

    I am way over my understanding, but plodding along. He is still alive and well.

    1. It depends how you define a ketogenic diet – it is usually a high fat, moderate protein and low carb diet but different people use different ratios of fat/protein/carb.
      https://www.cancer.gov/publications/dictionaries/cancer-terms/def/ketogenic-diet

      In essence, it means a diet which makes the body run on ketones not glucose. You can also achieve this by fasting.

      But if you use a keto approach, you need to consider what fats you use. A high PUFA diet may have some benefits. This article – although about human cancer – appears to describe the current understanding of nutritiona therapy for cancer. But it is about humans and what works for some cancers, may not work for others. The last paragraph may give you some ideas.
      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5951973/

      1. Thanks Tom.

        That is so helpful.

        Yes, the “it works for some Cancers and not for others” is such a big deal.

        Everything is like that.

        Dr. Greger says, “The devil is in the details” and it genuinely is.

        Today, I could have gotten conned by the types of things you are worried about, but I came back here and there were toxicity warnings on Mangosteen juice and Noni, I think it was. People did use it and had a reversal with their Cancers, but Dr. Greger showed the toxicity warnings.

        I am afraid of mistakes like that, because it is so easy to want to just jump into something when testimonies seem legitimate and these did. They weren’t professional and the emotion and frustration seemed genuine. The people weren’t selling anything and hadn’t written books. They just told their stories in the sloppy way that people who really walk through something do.

        There are a lot of people who do the whole “trying to get attention” version of testimonials, but their stories are more manipulative. The ones from today were people who went through so much and suddenly had a breakthrough and it was so tempting to buy a product to try, but I am fairly disciplined of search for “scam” search “pubmed” search sites like this.

        I am so grateful for that, because I know I could poison my dog if I listened even to all the opinionated lay people or charismatic speakers or authoritative medical people.

        The charismatic people fool me sometimes, but I won’t just incorporate anything into what I am doing without research and it is so ridiculous, because even PubMed has all sorts of good articles on something, then, I come here and it has toxicity or liver failure and that fact would be buried so deep that I didn’t get to it.

        People must fail at this process, out of fear and gullibility and lack of education in topics all the time.

        I talked to a few people today about what I am doing and the rationale and I showed one of them the mouse tumor of the regular drinking water and of the alkaline drinking water and he got squeamish and said, “I can’t handle looking at that at all.” But what happened is that he understands that I am trying things based on studies as much as possible.

        It doesn’t mean that I might not screw up. I just am doing a sincere process. I could see that he saw it. Almost everybody else thinks that I am not facing reality and they dismiss any science on the internet and any doctor on the internet and any doctor who is selling books or is famous.

        The photos when they look like a real lab, get some of them, but others don’t count that, unless it is an institution web-site, which they respect.

        I have one relative who worked at Harvard and one who went to MIT and I can get brownie points sometimes by using the right research.

  23. I could buy the soy powder they used to save the boy.

    I am not so sure about good soy powders or bad soy powders.

    I am trying to stay away from soy powder altogether.

    The soy powder did save the boy’s life and it has been over 10 years, but that is processed soy.

    I can’t figure out the math, because I am trying to stay under 15 dog servings of soy per day and I have been sticking with organic edamame and tempeh.

    I told my relative and the vet that I am trying to save my dog’s life. I waited a week, because he couldn’t move and wouldn’t eat when I started and had to be carried into the vet.

    They don’t believe that he will get healed and I am humbling myself, because I don’t know what is going to happen, but I want them to be able to have this conversation with me and not have it be a fight. It helps that it is my dog and they are being nice, because I am so attached to him. No fights at all. Just a few sentences, “You know he doesn’t have long to live” and I am laughing, because trying to save him is fun and if I wasn’t doing this, I would just be watching him die and that would not be fun.

  24. I am also interested in the Potassium / Sodium ratio.

    They said that no matter what the Carcinogenic agent, it is on the too much sodium, not enough Potassium side of the equation.

    I have to find your foods with Potassium chart again.

    Potatoes is what comes to mind.

    Pondering if giving my dog white potatoes might change his potassium / sodium ratio and if that one thing about white potatoes makes it almost a superfood, except that people put sodium on it.

  25. I found the Cancer my dog has, which the Vet hadn’t told me.

    They said it is the hardest type of Cancer in a dog.

    It told me that I am not being aggressive enough in treating it.

  26. The Internet vets all said that my dog has a death sentence, which is what the vet already said and he said that it is not much difference in survival time between doing nothing and doing everything.

    The good news is that my dog is still acting normal and he doesn’t seem to be in pain and I found out that he likes turmeric enough to lick it out of a bowl with flax oil and pepper.

    I have been giving him a little of everything, but he has a condition they say is so fast at metastases and already has a blood vessel and they bleed out and the vet said he already bled once and that they often are here one day and bleed out the next.

    I keep looking at my superfoods and wonder which one is most powerful. Dr Greger, which superfood do you see as most powerful?

    I am doing Turkey tail mushrooms, maitake mushrooms, turmeric, ginger, soy, flax nutritional yeast sweet potatoes parsley, decad green tea and assorted vegetables apples with peels and I am giving him barley because beta glucan seems like a good idea and alkaline water.

    Is there anything else I should be giving?

  27. I also am going to be starting dandelion root.

    People do essiac tea, blood root and bitter apricots.

    I haven’t figured out those. I don’t feel like I want to give blood root to a dog who could bleed out any second. I probably shouldn’t be doing the aspirin type plants with that?

  28. JUNE 20TH, 2018 AT 5:29 PM
    The problem with all supplement studies is that placebo based studies can’t really prove if something works or not. An actual lab study has a better chance.
    As for vitamin C, humans have always had the ability to make it – regardless of what almost everyone believes. And equally contrary to popular belief, scurvy has zero to do with vitamin C – And Vitamin C has zero to do with preventing or curing scurvy – or the common cold (though most people have figured out C does not prevent colds).

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